Episode Transcript
[00:00:04] Speaker A: What up, everybody?
[00:00:05] Speaker B: Welcome back to another episode of the Nerdjay Report. I'm your host, Pablo. And joining me as always, it's Mister Brian Schultz. Brian, the dust has settled. Everybody has gotten a moment to sort of rethink or think about the reveal at Comic Con that Robert Downey Junior is, is playing.
And I have to go back to listen to it. Victor von Doom. Brian, I've had a chance to listen to all the theories and speculation as to what storyline they're going to be going with and what they're trying to do. Brian it all makes sense to me. You know, there's one that makes more sense, one that he is still born Tony Stark, but his parents are disposed of very early, and he's adopted by the von Doom family, and he takes on the doom name.
That Brian, for me, it's like, okay, whatever. Right? Yeah. That's what you want to go with? Okay, listen, my sort of surprise and, like, disappointment at the choice has nothing to do really with Robert Downey Juniore as an actor, as a performer, whatever. That has nothing to do with him per se. My thing was wanting to see somebody else, somebody else play this role. I don't want to be distracted with the memory of Tony Stark, how great it was to now have to switch and take this opportunity when he does come on screen, which would probably be fantastic for end credit scene called a long time ago, and we're still not gonna get a taste of that till we see his move. We're only gonna probably see if you saw, like we just talked about, the Cape Crusader and the Joker coming in, right, and him saying something. We'll probably get something similar to that. We won't get any real determining instances of saying yes. That's victim outdoor. We may, we may note until Avengers doomsday, it'll be pretty impressive. Brian, if Robert Downey Junior can pull off what we think he's trying to pull off in playing a different character and still being praised for his performance, similarly to how he has been attached to the name Tony Stark for all these years.
I just wanted somebody else, not him. I get what they're trying to do. It makes sense in terms of he's not going to be playing this character for a lot longer than the two movies that they're going to be paying him. Millions and millions and millions and millions of dollars, which was released already. You already know.
[00:02:54] Speaker A: Yeah, let's get to that, because I think that matters to this discussion.
[00:02:57] Speaker B: Go ahead.
[00:02:58] Speaker A: So I'm 100% with you on this. I think there's a lot of questions. You know, one of the questions we speculate on our last show, because we did, we had just come, we were literally recording as Comic Con was still going on. Was, was he playing Victor von Doom? Was he playing Tony Stark? And they said he's playing Victor von Doom. But I think you outlined I key point, which is, why would we take that at face value?
We're so far into the multiverse and trying to fix the multiverse that, like, and now you're off. You're kind of off the comics storyline in some ways, anyway. So, like, they could say he's playing Victor von Doom. He could, they could do anything. They could say at the end of it. We could get there and be like, well, this wasn't the real victor Von Doom. There's another one. Like, they could do anything. So don't just assume that, like, hey, if I go read the latverian history, I'm going to get exactly what Robert Downey Junior is doing. That I don't think.
And that's why I think the terms of the agreement matter to this conversation, because they ain't thought that far ahead.
And if they say they have, look, if you read rise of the MCU, it is one of the most amazing themes is how little they actually thought that far ahead for how well it seemed like things flowed every step of the way. They kind of weren't thinking that far ahead. They were much more focused on getting that next movie, that next thing right, which served them very well.
But if you're gonna sit there and tell me that the motivation for this is creative, I have a lot of things to sell you.
Cause there's no way this is a commercial move. And I totally understand why it's happening. I just don't have to love it.
Now, here's what came out after about what Robert Downey Junior is getting. And then I have a question for you about this, because I am fish eyed about the whole thing. So he's getting a base salary. Base salary of $50 million per film plus back end on the box office.
So you can probably do the math if, like, this, Avengers movies are like a one and a half, 2 billion. 2 billion plus, like, he is making nine figures per movie easy. Okay, so that's number one. But if that wasn't enough, he's got a charter jet, which was home, which.
[00:05:21] Speaker B: Was part of the deal last time.
[00:05:23] Speaker A: So he gets that from home to the production. He gets his own security team, and he gets a, quote, trailer encampment. Listen, he's a star, right. And he's the star in the MCU. I get it. They're going to treat him as such. And they should.
The Russo brothers related story are getting $40 million each per film, and they get additional payouts if the films gross 750 and a billion. Boy, we're aiming low.
So here's my question to you. And I got asked this question. So doom.
Doom spends a lot of time in a mask.
Do you think Robert Downey. How much do you think Robert Downey is physically going to be involved with this production versus pulling a Pedro Pascal Mandalorian and just lending his vocal talents?
[00:06:13] Speaker B: Here's what I.
Even if he's not. Even if he's in the mask all the time and he's not, I don't care. I just want to see Doom.
From what I can see people posting up, people posting doom and putting Robert Downey, Julian his face on it, if that is a doom that we're going to get, I don't want it. I don't want Judge Dredd.
[00:06:39] Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. Great point. Great analogy. Yes. Of like, betraying. Betraying the identity of a character, an actor's ego.
[00:06:48] Speaker B: Yes. I wrote in a comment section on an instagram post where it was Robert Downey Junior in the cloak and all that stuff, and it showed his face. And I said, the fact that they're showing Doom's face and almost everything that we see now is disrespectful to the Doom character.
[00:07:08] Speaker A: I totally agree with you.
[00:07:10] Speaker B: So let's see, Brian, if what we see on what we saw on that night of the reveal of Robert Downey Junior being doomed will be similar in terms of who we see in the movie without the mask, I am not.
[00:07:28] Speaker A: There for that, because the reason I ask the question about the Pascal Mandalorian thing is, if Robert Downey Junior is mostly the voice of Doom and getting all this money and perks, I could see him being perfectly fine with being masked most of the time.
[00:07:48] Speaker B: I hope that's the case.
[00:07:50] Speaker A: If he's physically going to the set for four months, six months at a time for these movies, are we sure he's okay being behind a mask for most of his role? Given his notoriety and his star power and his ego, quite frankly, I'm more skeptical, which makes me think the more he's on set, the more likely we are to see Doom's face a lot.
[00:08:15] Speaker B: I'm scared that we're gonna get the Robert Downey Junior that thought.
What's that movie? Doctor Dolittle? Doolittle where he had saying a lot of hobbies.
[00:08:25] Speaker A: That'll be a very unfortunate, memeable parallel if Doctor Doom turns into Doctor Doolittle.
[00:08:31] Speaker B: I'm just saying, Brian, I don't want Robert Downey Junior to really take control of the storyline and what needs to be said because this is, you know, I don't know how much of Doom he knows. Hopefully he does read up on a lot of doom because Doom has a lot of classic lines and he just say stuff in a way not to be funny. Yeah, but he says it in a way to make his presence known.
[00:08:58] Speaker A: My fear, actually. And then we can talk about upside, but my fear is that he, Sherlock Holmes this. If you guys have ever seen the guy Richard Sherlock Holmes that he does, which comes after Iron man one. It's kind of like his next big tent pole after Iron man comes out.
Like, there's a character that has a long lineage in, obviously in stories, but in television and film, and it's basically just Robert Downey Junior doing Tony stark with a fit, kind of a hint of a british accent. Like, the movie's not terrible, but I don't think he's very good as Holmes because he's not trying to be Sherlock Holmes. He's trying to riff on himself with a little bit of Holmes quirks. That's my prime fear with this role is that he does the research and then says, but it has to be.
It has to be my. Like that. And now that's what.
Yeah, like the counter to that is, look, he is one of the most gifted actors of the last 30, 40 years. He is. Does he have it in him to do, you know, a different accent and a sadistic villain and a sinister villain and a, you know, a brilliant villain? Yes, he does have it in him. The question to me is, does he want it?
Does he want to transform? Does he want to do what ledger did and shock everyone with what he comes up with? Or does he want to be Robert Downey Junior riding to the rescue in another role for the MCU?
I don't think we can't know the answer to that question, but I think all of this hinges because, look, here's the other thing. Do you think anyone from Kevin Feige to the Russos is in any position to give him a note on anything at this point? Absolutely not.
So whatever he comes back with, that's.
[00:11:00] Speaker B: What they're gonna roll with.
[00:11:02] Speaker A: That's it.
[00:11:03] Speaker B: That's what's scary.
[00:11:04] Speaker A: That's it.
[00:11:05] Speaker B: And that's what's scary. Yo, he's on that stage revealing himself to the world to be doomed. Not because everybody else thought this was a good idea. It's because Robert Downey Junior thought it was a good idea.
[00:11:16] Speaker A: That's because, well, and in fairness, and because I think, I think, listen, what they did is very consistent with Bob Iger's marching orders in every other department. And we know that Iger has said publicly his number one focus was getting Marvel back on track. And what has Iger been prioritizing in his other franchises? Sequels. Familiar, right? Frozen three, frozen four. Moana two. So bringing the Russos back and bringing Robert Downey junior back is the Marvel version of that. You can't get more true to Igers new mantra for the mouse house than what they did.
But again, not a creative decision at all. That is a monetary decision. That is a, we got two Avengers movies coming up and they can't do, they can't be Justice League like, they can't at the box office.
[00:12:08] Speaker B: That is a true end. That is a true end.
[00:12:10] Speaker A: So that's the motivation.
We can go pro, we can go calm, but that is the motivation, whether we like it or not. That is what's driving this. And it's put Downey in this enormous position of power where he's going to make the decision about what this character becomes. And that makes me nervous because in Oppenheimer, which got him the Oscar, Christopher Nolan gave him notes. I will tell you, I can guarantee Nolan's a powerful enough director and Downey respects him enough that they could have a conversation about how he was going to portray his character. And there's still some vintage Downey in there, but there's other aspects of that personality, too. I just. So it may be great. It may be, you know, it may be the last carving on his mount Rushmore, but it could also be an it.
And they couldn't stop it even if they wanted to.
[00:13:04] Speaker B: That's, that's the thing. They, they are at his mercy.
[00:13:10] Speaker A: Yeah, that's a very do. They're in a very sort of doom ish position at the mercy of Doom, literally.
[00:13:19] Speaker B: All right. Upside, obviously, is the money because that's what they worried about. Right.
[00:13:25] Speaker A: Look, the first thing is they, they put a buzz around the Avengers movies again. That's, that's biggest, that buys you things. There's no question.
[00:13:34] Speaker B: But you, we all know this. We have to know this. That with this version of Doom and what they're trying to accomplish is ultimately supposed to be a reset of the MCU.
[00:13:48] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:13:49] Speaker B: So going in with that is like, you've taken a chance on going down on a really bad note, Brian, to already say, oh, we're going to start all over again anyway. Right.
[00:14:05] Speaker A: Well, that's why I still. Yeah, that's why I still hold fast to this belief that Kevin Feige is not stupid enough to mortgage the entire future of this franchise on a one and done or two and done Victor von Doom appearance. I just don't believe it. Which makes me suspicious that, like, by the end of the reset, by the like, it will somehow leave the door open for a new and true Victor von Doom to return in some capacity, because otherwise, that's a hell of a sacrifice. You're taking literally one of the top five, the five most highest profile, meaningful villains you have, and you are wiping them off the board. And unlike thanos, he had no build. He had no buildup. He just got to come in, throw 110 miles an hour for two movies, and then exit stays left. I think that's a tough thing to do.
So I just don't believe Kevin Feige is dumb enough to do that. So I. He has to be building in some sort of backdoor to where this von Doom doesn't preclude another von Doom from combating the Fantastic Four in the future or being involved in whatever next phase they've got.
[00:15:12] Speaker B: Yeah, but I don't think Kevin has a knack for doing backdoors, riding back doors, because, as we already know, the MCU was built on a chance.
Let's try this sort of approach.
[00:15:25] Speaker A: Yeah, I hear what you're saying, but. Yeah, it's just.
But they're boxing in the character any way they cut it, because Downey's interpretation, for better. Like, that's the thing. No one's gonna remember the Toby Cavill or the Julian McMahon. Like, nobody's remembering. Those are interpretations. If I asked anyone, like, what did you think about that? They'd be like, who? Yeah, so. But Downey's interpretation, good, bad, or mediocre, people are gonna remember.
[00:15:52] Speaker B: Certainly.
But again, here's the thing.
In those other iterations, Doom was in the mask, and he wasn't. Not entirely, but he was in a mask. And with or without the mask, it wasn't great.
[00:16:08] Speaker A: No, it's poor. Yeah.
[00:16:11] Speaker B: Robert Downey Juniore, he could be in and out of the mask, and it could be great. Or it has the app the chance to really disappoint Marvel fans, and that is the key there. Brian, I don't know if MCU exactly care about Marvel fans. They most likely care about the casual fans and the, you know, the people that came to see Robert Downey Juniore and. And the stuff that they built over, over this, this, this tenure, they're banking on that. And I get it. I get it. I just wanted somebody else because now we gotta live up to this dude.
[00:16:56] Speaker A: Yeah. Okay. So other, other, other pieces of upside.
So we know, we know. Cuz the Marvel did confirm this and I. The Fantastic Four is in the next two Avengers movies. They're in it.
[00:17:11] Speaker B: Okay.
[00:17:12] Speaker A: Okay. So we also know that pretty safely, Robert Downey is not in the Fantastic Four movie, other than maybe the end credits. Right. He's not in the mood.
So if I was to say, what could be cool, what could be fun? Well, you know, do some de aging, do some flashback. Little Pedro, little younger looking, long, young Pedro Pascal opposite young RDJ. When Reed and I, Victor von Doom, were friends, that I'm interested to see that I think could be some good filmmaking if you wrote it well. And presumably that would be more likely in the Avengers movie now than in the Fantastic Four movie.
[00:17:52] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:17:53] Speaker A: So, you know, those are the types of scenes where he's not in the mask, where I could say that's valid and that's interesting. And we actually have not really seen that played out on screen before.
[00:18:05] Speaker B: So that's, that take, that Audi J takes for this character will be very. It'll. It'll either keep you on your toes for the very few moments to see where it goes, or you'll get a sense immediately, like, this is not gonna work. I'm sorry.
[00:18:24] Speaker A: Oh, if he. I'm telling you, those first lines, if they pop anything in the trailer and you're just like, he's. He's just doing Tony Stark, but he's bad guy. It's over. It's over. Like, I. That's it.
[00:18:38] Speaker B: Let's see. Brian, did you see the.
[00:18:41] Speaker A: To this? Did you see the. Did you see the leaked Fantastic Four footage?
[00:18:44] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:18:45] Speaker A: So they're fully formed as the fantastic. This is why I'm talking about flashback, because we know beyond a shadow of a doubt, and even if that's test footage, they are fully developed and realized as the first family.
[00:18:57] Speaker B: Mm hmm.
[00:18:58] Speaker A: So, yeah, like the only way to have Pascal and RDJ kind of head to head in any sort of. You have to go back in time at this point. Yeah. Yeah.
[00:19:07] Speaker B: So, but interesting to see, like, if you see the Fantastic Four in their headquarters and stuff like that, and you see a fly running, fly buzzing around and that's Victor von Doom. Usually that's his mo, like, he has little stuff, video camera and everything, so he can see everything.
[00:19:26] Speaker A: Yeah. Well, that's also, you know, the style of villain here. Again, I'm searching for how can this work and where can they make it interesting and different is, you know, Thanos is obviously very intelligent, very complex, but he's an incredibly physical foe, right? Huge, you know, impossible almost to kill. Straight up. Doom is not really. That's very different. Right. Like Doom, it's like you're more interested in the mental battle. You're more interested in sort of beating the machinations of doom as much as, like any, you almost don't want to see hand to hand with Doom. Like, what's the point of that? Like, I, you know, even if it might have to come to that, I feel like I'm much more interested in, like, wits. Right. I want to see that prove to me Reid is the smartest person on the planet going up against this guy.
[00:20:09] Speaker B: That is true. But one thing that I've seen often in animation and in cuts in comics is dooms is very formidable.
And there's this quote that fantastic Reeb says he's the most dangerous man on the world on the planet. He says something to that effect. So there's this dude, the smartest man on the world, worried about this dude and what he's thinking and what he's doing.
[00:20:38] Speaker A: But if I was to draw an analogy, since we've moved on from Jonathan Majors, like the best villainous majors is the Loki Majors, where it's as much a battle of wits as it is a battle of Mike. The low point to me, of the Jonathan Major's Kang experience is the fistfight with Paul Rudd.
[00:20:57] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:20:58] Speaker A: It's just, I know, like, the minute that started, I was like, when is this over? I don't care at all. And this is a complete waste of Kang's villainy to have him in a hand to hand combat with Ant Mandez. Yeah, so that's what I mean. It's not that Dune doesn't get his hands dirty. It's more that when he makes his entrance, it's almost like a Darth Vader level of kind of power. It's like he saves it and then unleashes it.
[00:21:22] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, again, this is going to be very interesting to see what Robert Junior is able to pull off with this character. If he's able to make us forget about him being Tony Stark, which is going to be, quite honestly, very, very difficult to do, is not impossible.
But if he can make us at least for a moment, not think about him while he's performing.
That'll be the success that he has with this character. Because if he speaks and I'm reminded of the Tony Stark that we used to watch, is all down here for a hill.
[00:22:00] Speaker A: From there, the movie doesn't work. I don't think it works. If he's a wise cracking villain, it does not work.
[00:22:06] Speaker B: No, no. Let's see. Let's see if that is the approach he takes and let's see if someone has the balls to tell him, no.
[00:22:14] Speaker A: I think there's no chance. I think there's no chance. No chance of Maximus in the tunnel. No.
[00:22:20] Speaker B: If you. If you're. If you're the Russos and you're behind the camera and you see that, are.
[00:22:25] Speaker A: You just letting this ride a hundred percent? Yes.
[00:22:29] Speaker B: Month for months at a time. Oh, man. That's.
[00:22:31] Speaker A: That's a.
There's just no way. They might be. They might be, like, jabbing each other onto the table and they're like, can't do it. Great, Robert. That was great.
One more take. Oh, no. You're done for the day. We're good.
[00:22:47] Speaker B: Oh, my God. I hope not, man.
[00:22:50] Speaker A: I hope. I'm sorry. I just. There's no other. There's just no other way. He knows it. He's a smart guy. He knows he has all the leverage.
[00:22:58] Speaker B: But how?
[00:22:59] Speaker A: And now the other thing that inevitable is, you know, when is Chris Evans signing, right? Like, he's going to tell. Like, we know the roster stinks. We know Kevin basically finally told you the roster stinks, right. Can I just read that quote, by the way? I know we got to do that. There might be a whole other show, but can I just read this quote? Cause it's like if you want to see a coach basically saying my roster is terrible, this is. This is Kevin Feige's version of it. It.
Because he was talking about the cast for the next Avengers movies.
I rarely speak in absolutes like that. Right. The notion of never seeing anyone else again. So I never talk in absolutes like that. But the truth is, you know, we're gonna tell a story in these Avengers movies and there won't be room for a hundred thousand characters in it. So choices will have to be made. That's for sure. But that doesn't mean you won't ever see anybody ever again. Again. That's code for my roster sucks.
[00:23:55] Speaker B: Yeah, I told you. What did I send you after that? Let the draft begin when we.
[00:24:00] Speaker A: And we should do the actual draft. But it's like when you then hear they already confirmed Fantastic Four is in this movie and now Robert Downey's doom. Like, all of that is because the Avengers lineup is poor. So. Which is why they're gonna need cap. Like Steve Rogers cap. They're gonna need these other guys somehow to reappear and fight the guy that was on their team and sacrificed himself for the universe, even though it's not the same guy. They need to do that. And you and Ryan are in. There's no cool. They're all in the movies. No question. Because they have to be to make it, to make it profitable.
[00:24:40] Speaker B: This is gonna be very interesting.
I remember that first, after the first show we did, after the announcement, you said, let's not bury the leak. This is going. Any leaks, reports, or anything coming out of this camp, the MCU, anything has to do with Robert Downey Junior, Avengers, whatever, is going to be the lead story.
[00:25:02] Speaker A: Yep.
[00:25:03] Speaker B: So we're going to have a lot of fun for the next few years.
[00:25:08] Speaker A: That's. They have event. They have re eventized two Avengers movies that, before they made that announcement, nobody cared about.
[00:25:18] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:25:21] Speaker A: That doesn't mean they're gonna be great movies.
[00:25:23] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:25:24] Speaker A: We're just seeing it right now with Deadpool and Wolverine. Not a great, great movie, but it's an event.
[00:25:30] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:25:31] Speaker A: And it's working. That's what they're after.
[00:25:33] Speaker B: And that's what we said it was gonna be. Event spectacularity. All this stuff to get people to the. To the theaters, and they're able to do it that way.
Still based on the rep.
Yeah, but not of the story that they built over time, which was the thing for me, Brian, that got me to the theaters.
[00:25:58] Speaker A: So I got to throw in this last note. I know we're up against time here. We did get a small piece of positive news that flew under the radar, although it was a little bit weird.
Steven Marcus is coming back to do the rewrite.
[00:26:11] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:26:11] Speaker A: McFeely is not. So they got one of the two. I don't know why they couldn't get the other one. I was like, apparently, the. Apparently the bags that they were leaving around, they were like, wait, we're a few million short. So McFeely didn't make the cut. I don't know what happened. Anyway, Stephen Marcus is coming back. But one thing that I think will be tested here that we just don't know for sure.
We know James Gunn was on that set for Infinity War and Endgame, doing touch ups, doing rewrites, like, doing. We know that that was truth. We don't know how much it mattered. We don't know how much of it was being done. We're gonna find out, I think, in these two movies, because you can't accomplish projects of this scale unless tonally, you can successfully link Deadpool and Wolverine with what you're doing in brave new world and what you're doing, you know, with maybe even if you're going to bring in, you know, Fantastic Four, which is like a retro look, like that's challenging if you're trying to do that. If we believe, like, rise of the MCU between Joss Whedon earlier on in the process and James Gunn toward the end, they were kind of ghostwriting, like, on set while these movies were being made. Who is that person to kind of make sure things don't go off the rails? Because we've kind of seen with the Russos when they don't have the rails.
[00:27:32] Speaker B: I'll put the email at the bottom of the screen. You can email me right there. I'm available. I'm available. Help out with the task of writing a compelling story, Ryan, because that is the worry. That is the worry that the variables that were around that time aren't there anymore. So we get something new.
[00:27:54] Speaker A: Yeah, but bad news for Stephen Marcus, though, is that, like, whatever he writes, Robert Downey is probably going to rewrite it if you want.
[00:28:01] Speaker B: We're going to see. We're going to see, like, you know, how Spike Lee's doing. Written by Spike Lee, produced by Spike Lee, screenplay by Scott. It's going to be like that, yo.
If not, it should be a joke for Deadpool four.
Let us know in the comment section below what you guys think of what this Victor Von Doom will bring to the table for the MCU, for the Avengers, for the story that they're trying to do here. I know some of you are very familiar with it, but let us know in the comment section below. Are you guys excited for this next Avengers movies? Are you excited to see RDJ back as Doom after you've had some time to think about this? I know initially you were like, what was happening? Most people were. The only people that weren't like that are the fans that were ready to screen for anything. You could have thrown anybody in that scene.
[00:29:08] Speaker A: They would have screamed, yeah, I mean, in fairness, it's a perfect hall h moment. And I remember, like, go back and find the reaction when. When they announced dawn of Justice and they put the bat signal behind the Superman logo. People lost their minds, right? Like, look what happened after that you think those people like still feel great about their decision to scream that day. I mean but that's the point of hall eight, right? It's about effect, it's not about, you know I would've shocked Brian.
[00:29:33] Speaker B: I would've looked if you and I was standing in that room I would have looked at you like yo what's going on here? Yo what's bullshit.
[00:29:39] Speaker A: The moderate, I think Chris Hardwick was the moderator. He did have the proper reaction cuz he like when they did even though I'm sure he knew it was coming and he's like hamming up. He goes what does it literally just like screams that out.
[00:29:52] Speaker B: So anyway, but oh snap. Yeah. Let us know in the comments below what you guys think. And remember hit that like and subscribe button and we'll see you next time on the jury for the show goes off.
It.
