Jon Stewart Casting Sparks Buzz and Controversy– Is Aaron Pierre the Perfect Choice?

[00:00:04] Speaker A: What up everybody? Welcome back to another episode of the Nursery Report. I'm your host, Pablo and joining me, as always, is Mr. Brian Schultz. Brian, we're going to be talking about a lot of things today, especially DC related, some Marvel stuff. Certainly some of the announcements that were mentioned mentioned that nycc yo. Brian. I didn't even know that was happening yo until like the day before. I was like, word. I would have probably made, you know, made some plans to go out there, you know, and do something, but whatever. But one thing, Brian, they've continuously was sort of popping up from time to time on my feeds, on Instagram, on YouTube, especially one individual that I. That I follow on YouTube. I think his caught he eman's review and he mentioned it. And so I sort of started thinking about it like, but. And it just sort of like I started thinking about it deeply. Brian. Like, why is this a problem? From my perspective, Brian, I look at it simply as the shade of a person. Brian Shade. Not that he's not black. Is that he don't. That his. His shade is not dark enough. Brian. And then there's. I was watching John Campia and, and one of the panelists said that he looks exactly like the Jon Stewart of Justice League Unlimited. And I was like, not really, yo. They don't really look alike. Why are we bothered by the shade? I get it, Brian, that the original guy that created this character wanted him to look a specific way. But come on. Your thoughts, Brian, on this sort of not necessarily backlash, but the fact that we're discussing in my, from my perspective again, his shade. Brian, your thought? [00:02:29] Speaker B: I don't think we totally agree on this. I got that sense. We were texting last night. So I think there's more than one conversation here though. First, let me give you a quote. James Gunn was at New York Comic Con, had a chance to comment on Aaron Pierre as Jon Stewart. So I just want to give you that for a little background as a lead in quote. Aaron Pierre is somebody I've wanted to work, who I've wanted to work together with for a long time. People don't know, but he was almost cast as Adam Warlock. Interesting knowledge drop. He's an amazing actor and I really just admired him from the beginning of his career. And seeing him read with Kyle, meaning Kyle Chandler, was one of those miraculous moments. I don't care what they're saying, I just love what they're saying together. End quote. So, you know, kind of confirms what we suspected. Chemistry played a big part in the role. Okay, so let's talk about this because this is going to be a little bit thorny. I tried to read up on this. The term you're referring to is colorism. That's sort of what people are talking about here. I think there's. It is backlash. I don't sense that as much backlash to Aaron Pierre the actor. I don't see a lot of that. Right. I don't see a lot of people saying, Aaron Pierre, the actor is incapable of delivering an outstanding performance as Jon Stewart. I think if you were telling me that and you were telling me that because of the shade, that would be a real difficult conversation. Yeah, I think the backlash is a more global backlash at Hollywood. That's what I interpret. Where there's a thematic concern that actors or actresses being asked to play roles of people of color, that Hollywood maintains a bias to give those roles to personnel that are lighter. That's what I. And they're saying this casting is the latest example of a character whose origin is of a certain color. And the winning actor was considerably lighter than that color. So to me, those are two somewhat different conversations. On the first one, I'm all in on Aaron. I'm totally fine. As we. You can look at our shows, right. We pitched him before he was hired. [00:05:01] Speaker A: I didn't know about all this stuff. This was prior to all this talk about what we're talking about right now. Brian. [00:05:08] Speaker B: Yeah. So obviously, the two of us have kind of said, we watched Rebel Ridge and we said, that guy could be Jon Stewart. That was like, we're looking at the performance, we're looking at the characterization. We're like, we can translate that. So you can kind of tell from our show that neither of us really kind of looked at this topic. It is interesting, though, and I'll try to tie this into a couple of personal things. I went back and I looked at who I pitched A month before Rebel Ridge came out. There's a show we did about casting Green Lantern. So I pitched Damson, Idris, Lionel Boyce and Stefan James, who wound up being the runner up. I probably didn't consciously actively do it, but when I look back on it, I was probably looking at how Jon Stewart is drawn, including how he's shaded. And I was looking for actors who I thought could most approximate that, which would have included that feature. So I think if you look at the three names that I pitched, they are like, Aaron Pierre is probably lighter than those three. It didn't stop me from seeing Aaron Pierre and saying, I think he could be a great Jon Stewart. But it probably was a factor in why I didn't have him on my original list. [00:06:26] Speaker A: Yeah, Brian, I did not know of Aaron Pierre, only the mention of him in the projects that he were, he was attached to, that he was then no longer attached to, which was Blade. I know that he has done other stuff, but I don't, I haven't seen those things. To really be like, you know, Leonardo DiCaprio and pointing like, you know, that's him. Right. I did that with Corn Sweat, though, when Hollywood came out on Netflix, prior to Hollywood, probably prior to that show coming out, when I saw that promo and saw him, I did the Leonardo stuff. Anyway, again, Brian, when we saw Rebel Ridge, immediately we said, yo, we gotta talk about this. Because the obvious is. This is obvious. It's obvious. That's the title of our thumbnail. It's obvious. And so I didn't even think about this stuff. Now the people that are thinking about it, I mean, I, I, I, I would be more ups. Disappointed, Brian, is the word that people are using in some of the stuff that's happening with the current stuff that we want to see, like with Superman and crypto and all this other stuff. The hope is that Aaron Pierre, when he's on the circuit and doing his thing, you know what I'm saying? That he doesn't have to address it. He may have. He will address it. [00:08:05] Speaker B: 100%. This is going to come up, not in every interview, but there'll be places where this will come up. How do you feel about this? I started reading about this and I realized that there were two, at least in my opinion, people can disagree that there were two separate conversations going on here. That Aaron Pierre was a vessel for this bigger theme that people were focused on in Hollywood, I try to connect with it in my own way. And I think I kind of got there. So if people watching can't tell. And I've mentioned this before, I'm half Korean, so I identify with Far east culture. And so I pay attention to that in cinema and in literature. I'm going to pick on some pretty good actors here for a second. But to make my point, so if someone came out tomorrow and said, we're going to make the defining biopic of Bruce Lee, and Bruce Lee is going to be played by Henry Golding, I would be offended. And if someone came out, who's Henry Golding? Starring of Crazy Rich Asians. And if someone said to me, I'm going to make a fantastical epic adventure about Musashi Miyamoto, who's the greatest, most legendary samurai swordsman in Japanese history, and he's going to be played by Keanu Reeves. I would be offended. [00:09:26] Speaker A: Oh, hell yeah. [00:09:27] Speaker B: Now, that's a little more on the nose. But the point I'm making is that would be. And if that happened again and again and again were a character of a specific ethnicity, where the ethnicity of Asian ethnicity, where that ethnicity informed their life or informed who they were, and Hollywood simply took anyone of any Asian descent and put them in that role, I would start to look funny at that and say, what's going on here? And if Hollywood then patted me on the head and said, you should be okay with that because, well, Henry Golding is from a different part of Asia and Keanu Reeves is part Asian, I would probably start to feel a certain way about that. I think that's a somewhat of a parallel to what this theme is. I feel like if someone over time who has roots or ties to different parts of the world and is then being told, well, these black characters are all the same, as long as there's the actor portraying them, has some color in them, how can I feel that way about Asian characters and then tell them, forget about it, don't worry about it. In this case, I don't think I can do. I think that would be hypocritical. That's why I think it's not totally. [00:10:48] Speaker A: But let me ask you this. [00:10:50] Speaker B: Or silly for this to come up in this context. [00:10:53] Speaker A: Is he half black halfway? [00:10:56] Speaker B: Not as far as I know. [00:10:58] Speaker A: Because if that was the case, because I don't know. You know, I don't think. [00:11:03] Speaker B: I don't think so, but I think. [00:11:05] Speaker A: I'm totally looking at it from. He looks like a Green Lantern. He looks perfect for, like, Green Lantern, you know what I'm saying? For a new. I get what people. Yeah. I didn't even know what the intention was of the original creator of John. Of Jon Stewart. So if I had known that, perhaps it still probably wouldn't have bothered me that much. Brian, because he looks like we people. [00:11:29] Speaker B: That's true. And I think you can. I think you can both be excited to see Jon Stewart brought to life. And you can still bring this up, which I think that's what I'm saying is like, I'm going to take it a step further. Let's say Henry Golding went out and absolutely crushed Bruce Lee. Like, he adopted the voice. He learned wushu, like, and you just like, he is the incarnation of Bruce Lee, but he doesn't look like Bruce Lee. And he's not. He doesn't have Chinese origin. [00:11:55] Speaker A: Descent. Yeah. [00:11:56] Speaker B: How would I feel about that on the screen? Like, could I totally. Like, if he just gave that performance, could I totally ignore that? Would it take away 5% of my. I don't know. See, that's the thing, is I don't know the answer, but I can tell you that I would be biased against the project because of that choice. From day one, I would say this guy doesn't look. He doesn't look anything like Bruce Lee. He doesn't have the same origins as Bruce Lee. And I really wish Hollywood had given me someone that had a more accurate background. Bruce Lee. [00:12:27] Speaker A: So. [00:12:31] Speaker B: So I guess that's what I'm saying is if someone feels that way about this, I can't tell them that it's a nothing. I can't tell them, like, hey, don't worry about it. Because I think what they're really saying is this is happening repeatedly, and I'm tired of it. So why does it need to happen repeatedly? What is it about Hollywood that is preventing them from casting in a way that is color accurate to, in this case, a character who's always been drawn? [00:13:05] Speaker A: I get it. [00:13:06] Speaker B: That's. That's where I would say, like, yeah, it's not. I don't think it's fair to kind of just throw that away. [00:13:10] Speaker A: Yeah. But. So, okay, this is his background I looked up. He is Jamaican Kurakawan and. And Sierra Leonen and from Sierra Leone descent. For me, Brian, I look at it as we. I get it. He's a shade lighter, but that's how I look at it. And for me, I just, you know, he's from those places and he just happens to be a shade lighter. That's. That's it. [00:13:47] Speaker B: Yeah. I'm not. Yeah. That. It's like, is it going to take away my personal enjoyment of this particular performance? It will not. I mean, that's why we pitched him beforehand. [00:13:54] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:13:54] Speaker B: But I was trying to empathize with people for whom it is a recurring disappointment. So Jon Stewart, for references, simply listed as being from Detroit, Michigan, if you. If you care. The character, he is always drawn dark. Yeah, that's. [00:14:08] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:14:09] Speaker B: And so I think that's. That's really what people are. Are fixated on. And now the part, I cannot answer, and I'm not qualified to answer is since it is a spectrum of color. Where. Where is it? Okay. And where is it not? I don't know. Right. Like, I was looking at my list and I was like, edris Boyce and James, would they have all been. Had any one of them been cast, would this have, would that have been celebrated on this front and there been no backlash for that? I, I don't, like, I don't know. Right. I'm not, I'm not qualified to tell you like what is the right shape in this case. [00:14:47] Speaker A: But to be fair, Brian, when I was looking at, I mean I had one. Jay Ellis was one that I had. [00:14:55] Speaker B: Right. [00:14:56] Speaker A: Had up there. [00:14:57] Speaker B: Yep. I wasn't even gotten the same. That probably would have gotten some similar backlash if he had been picked. [00:15:04] Speaker A: But I was one of the other guys. [00:15:09] Speaker B: Sterling K. Brown. He probably would have. Yeah, that would have been. Nobody would have had this topic if that happened, I think. [00:15:16] Speaker A: And one of the other guys that I've mentioned for Black Panther, he's the media. Yes, yes, yes, yes. So I was. But I was just thinking like, who could be a green, a good Green Lantern as African American or you know, African descent, who's black. That's all. [00:15:34] Speaker B: That's where I draw the Asian parallel because I think people are saying there is, there's ethnicity and then there's ethnicity within ethnicity. Right. And that's why I say like there's Asian, but there's East Asian, there's South Asian, there's Korean, there's Chinese. Right. So there are distinctions. And those distinctions to me do matter in certain roles. So I can't say that and then tell someone, well, you shouldn't care at all about this. I wasn't thinking about it. I'll admit that when I put, I literally, when I put the original list together, I literally was just like matching the page. And then when I saw Aaron Pierre, I was like, oh, this guy, performance wise can rock it. Right. That's all. I was kind of thinking someone else was like, yeah, but great actor, don't begrudge him getting the role. But this fits into this theme of Hollywood always tends to skew this way for these big time parts. And that bothers me. I don't think I can tell them, don't be bothered. [00:16:33] Speaker A: No, I just don't want it to be a big thing, you know, I don't want this to be like right now we're discussing it. Just don't want it to be. Is that I don't want to be this cloud that when this comes out that people are pointing out. [00:16:52] Speaker B: I mean, I don't think it will derail the show if he's, if he's as good as we think and the show is as good as we think it's more a question probably for James Gunn and Peter Saffron, honestly. But, like, here's the thing about it. I also got to. And you kind of referenced it earlier. There are at least three other parts that will be coming in the next couple of years where I do think there will be eyes on this issue. And the degree to which there was this reaction to Aaron Pierre I think has wised me up a little bit to that discussion. So number one is T'Challa's son. Right. That's going to clearly be one that people will watch closely to see how that goes. Number two, Miles Morales. That's I think, going to be a really interesting and important one for that choice. And number three is Storm, who I would point out in X Men 97 is drawn significantly darker than she's drawn in the 90s X Men. And that's clearly no accident. [00:17:57] Speaker A: Yes. [00:17:57] Speaker B: She's an African princess. [00:17:59] Speaker A: Yes. And I had to wand the wise on my. On my list. I don't know if you know her. [00:18:06] Speaker B: I do not. [00:18:07] Speaker A: She's from. They did. I. I don't know. You're familiar with the movie Spike Lee. She's gotta have it. [00:18:12] Speaker B: Okay. [00:18:13] Speaker A: I did a show. They did a show on Netflix sort of based on that. And she was the lead. And she's. She is like. Like imagine Liz Taylor, but black. She is. She has that Aurora Storm look from Africa. Exotic, beautiful. It. She has that look. And she would be perfect. Perfect. It's one of those obvious choices, Brian. [00:18:53] Speaker B: Okay. [00:18:53] Speaker A: From my perspective. [00:18:55] Speaker B: Okay. [00:18:55] Speaker A: But if they need to get somebody from Africa that needs to speak a certain way, I'm pretty sure she can do it. But again, this is acting. Right. So we just get the right person for the. For the. For the job. [00:19:05] Speaker B: I'm just saying I do think people will be hypersensitive to this issue as it pertains to those three roles. So two. Two of which the characters have African origin. Right. Storm and. And T'Challa's son. [00:19:18] Speaker A: Yes. [00:19:18] Speaker B: And then Miles Morales, who's. Who's definitely drawn a certain way consistently in the Com. Right. That I think those three characters. If you see someone who is deemed to be very light or half or something like that there, you know, Halle Berry again. Right. If you see somebody like that, like, I think people will complain vocally. And it would be an issue if this dude's. [00:19:45] Speaker A: What's his name? Vic. Vic. Damn it, Vic. That guy from Penguin. Vic. If he's in the. If he's. Because we. You already know that. Miles Morales will probably be on the radar for that guy because he's good. He's good enough. [00:20:05] Speaker B: Is he young enough, though? [00:20:06] Speaker A: Probably not. [00:20:07] Speaker B: He seems a little old for where they would start, Miles. [00:20:10] Speaker A: They would. They wouldn't. They would need to start from scratch and find somebody, like, brand new. [00:20:14] Speaker B: You would say they need a teenager. [00:20:17] Speaker A: Yeah, but does he have to be. So here we. Here we go. His. Where does he come from? Is he just a guy that looks the part and can play the part, but he's not from either. Or this? And what. How do you. How do you cast for that? [00:20:31] Speaker B: I don't know. Again, like I said, I just think people will be looking for a very. They clearly are going to be. [00:20:40] Speaker A: There's going to be a problem with. [00:20:41] Speaker B: The microscope on the color on the pages and the color on the screen. And that's what I was saying. Like, I'm not qualified to say, like, where is that acceptable? Right. Like, I'm not. Like, I, you know, I think I don't have the sensitivity to that when it comes to. I think, you know, like I said, some of the examples I used before in Asian culture, like, yeah, I feel like I can distinguish that a little bit easier based on personal experience, but for someone else, I just saying, like, this. This opened my eyes a bit to the issue as a whole, but certainly within our genre, this, like, clued me into, like, oh, this is going to be a really big deal when these characters come to the screen. A really big deal. [00:21:19] Speaker A: And that. And just before we sign off, and I sign off, but continue the conversation into the D.C. stuff, I just don't want this to be a big thing. Like. Like we've said when we were casting, we weren't even thinking about this. [00:21:39] Speaker B: Yeah, but see, okay, so we got to go back and forth because I think part of the reason people want to make the big thing out of it is so that they can affect change in the future. Right. That's part of why I get that. Yes. And, like, if you whitewash Snow Miles and T'Challa's son. [00:21:54] Speaker A: Yeah, no, no, no, no. [00:21:56] Speaker B: I kind of do. I do. [00:21:58] Speaker A: Because of people saying, like, listen, I would say save. There was a rumor a couple of years ago about that they were considering casting Julia Roberts as Harriet. Was it Harriet Tubman? [00:22:17] Speaker B: No, that couldn't be possible. [00:22:20] Speaker A: There was a rumor. Say, for me, that is outrage. Right? For me, that is outrage. And some of the stuff that they've done is outrage. I don't think this is that, though. You know, I don't Think it's that crazy, yo. That's what I think. [00:22:36] Speaker B: I think it's a more nuanced discussion, but that's what I'm saying. I think, I think it's the discussion of there's representation and then there's representation within representation. And I think this is the latter. Right. I think this is the specifics of representation to different segments of the same group, if that makes sense. Right. It's like if I was filling out boxes on an application or a citizen, everybody who's from the continent of Asia would check Asian. But that doesn't make us the same. [00:23:07] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:23:08] Speaker B: And I think that's what's being had here, is that, like, within this particular group, not everyone's the same. Not everyone shares the same origin, not everyone has the same pigment. And. But that's what we want to see. People want to see that range reflected across characters. Like, I don't. I don't think that's a zero. [00:23:30] Speaker A: Like, no, no. [00:23:31] Speaker B: As I said, it's not going to prevent me from. And I don't think it is for a lot of them either. I think they're still going to embrace Aaron Pierre if he delivers the performance. But they can also, on the other hand, say it could have and maybe should have been someone who looked more accurate to all the details of Jon Stewart. And therefore I'm going to make noise about that because Aurora Monroe is coming and Miles Morales is coming. And I don't. I want to see that represented more precisely. I see a Hollywood machine that has it. [00:24:08] Speaker A: I get it. I get it. I get that perspective. I get that perspective. [00:24:14] Speaker B: I will say if the show is great and he's great, I don't think this will, like, somehow outshine that. It won't. [00:24:20] Speaker A: And if it's bad, it won't be because of that either. You know what I'm saying, Craig? [00:24:26] Speaker B: We won't. We certainly won't be saying that's why it was bad. [00:24:29] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I. [00:24:32] Speaker B: That's an interesting. More interesting question. If the show is bad and he's somehow bad, will people use that as a vehicle for this issue? Maybe there's some. But I, you know, but you. But it won't be why the show is bad. [00:24:45] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:24:46] Speaker B: If the show fails, it won't be because of that. But I think, yeah, I'm trying to empathize with the people who are like, there's. There's more to be done here and Hollywood needs to be more attentive to. As to that, you would say the details matter. [00:25:01] Speaker A: I get that perspective, but I wasn't looking at it from that perspective. We weren't looking at. From that perspective where we would cast. [00:25:08] Speaker B: We didn't view it as disqualifying. [00:25:10] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:25:11] Speaker B: If people want to weigh in on the topic of colorism, which I believe is the appropriate word for the discussion, and how they feel about it, and how they feel about it as it pertains to the casting of Jon Stewart in this case, and how much they're differentiating kind of the Aaron Pierre performance from the broader issue. Let us know. I mean, I think we're in the process of being educated on it as well. I certainly am trying to do. Been trying to do some reading in the past couple of days, so. And people. And how people are connecting with it and. And how much it matters to the future castings of Storm. Miles Morales and T'Challa son in particular. [00:25:48] Speaker A: Those. Those are huge. Those are huge. Catching. And I'm going to be paying attention to that, Brian. I'm going to be looking at that very closely. If you were to ask me. Brian, this is a question not for us to get into it, but this is an interesting question. I think if they were to announce that Storm is going to be played by Zendaya, how would I feel about it? [00:26:21] Speaker B: I think it's an appropriate. I think it's an appropriate parallel because that's exactly who I was thinking of when you were saying, I don't think it will be her. But. No, I think you're right. I think. I think there would be a reaction, and I think the reaction would be, we love Zendaya personally and as a performer, we don't love the choice. That's what it would be. [00:26:37] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. From that perspective, I see the issue. James Gunn has made some announcements, Brian. Perhaps they weren't what we were expecting to see, but there were announcements nonetheless. Some insight as to some inspirations for the movies and for the shows that he's doing that he's very excited about. Brian. Creature Commandos, Brian. We'll talk about that. We'll talk about Crypto the Dog and its inclusion in the Superman movie Peacemaker. He says some good things about how that process is going, basically, is what he's doing and where things are going and when they're coming out or whatever. Right. Brian, your thoughts on which one do you want to tackle first? [00:27:34] Speaker B: Let's do Superman stuff first. I think let's do Superman first. That's still the flagship project. So we really have two main updates here. So number one was a Social media update where he puts a picture up of David Corn Sweat in costume with his back to you. And there's Crypto the dog next to him. And they're watching the world go by. And the Internet had thoughts on crypto, because crypto, crypto is based. So crypto, he clearly admits he used his own dog, a smaller breed dog, as the basis for the crypto he's putting on screen. To which most people said, wait, isn't Crypto generally a retriever in the comics? And as we saw, like in Super Pets, to which James Gunn responded, he's alien. And therefore his appearance should kind of be all over the place and not be reflected by one human breed dog. This has become the latest sort of controversy, if you will, in Superman is the look of Crypto, who presumably, as we know, is in Supergirl as well. So I'm assuming same. It'll be the same dog. [00:28:48] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. [00:28:49] Speaker B: Did you care? [00:28:53] Speaker A: I looked at it, Brian, as a distraction. [00:28:57] Speaker B: That he was there at all or. [00:28:58] Speaker A: That how it looked that he was there at all. Why? That means that throughout this film or at some point at this film, he is gonna be around, distracting, causing Mr. Terrific to go chase this dude around. Mr. Terrific, the smartest dude on Earth. Gotta go get this dog. Gotta figure out how to get this dog right. That's what we're doing. This is going to be 15, 20 minutes of crypto the dog just running around. Dare he save Superman? Superman. He's saving Superman needs a hand. Unless there's kryptonite around. I get that. You throw a piece of dust and you, you've debilitated him. [00:29:53] Speaker B: Go fetch the kryptonite. [00:29:55] Speaker A: You know what I'm saying? So that's how I'm looking at this, Brian. I'm looking at the story and how and where am I going to be spending my time when I'm watching this? That's how I'm looking at it, Brian. [00:30:13] Speaker B: Well, it is a very James Gunn thing, though. I think this is was. I think this. We knew Crypto was coming. And I think it's unavoidable that we were going to get this aspect of Superman because I think James Gunn has that lighter, heartwarming side and he's trying to portray that in this Superman. And so I think it's inevitable. I think to your point, clearly the key is how much does Crypto have to or get to do in this movie before we start asking questions. But on the flip side, it's comics accurate. I mean, he is part of Superman's Life. And so I think that's part of what James would argue is that, like, I'm trying to bring this, you know, classic Superman to life. And classic Superman includes having Superman's best friend. And so. Yeah, but I think you're right. I mean, I think it's. If we have a. If we have a whole set piece built around crypto, then I would expect James Gunn would be getting a call from Ryan Reynolds saying, yo, crypto versus dog pool crossover. And that better not happen. Yeah, but, you know, if he's here and there and you kind of see him and it's more like Where's Waldo? Then I think it's fine. I need to slap about the breed. Whatever. I mean, I mean, I get it. [00:31:26] Speaker A: It doesn't have to. We. Let's not go crazy in terms of accuracy, right? [00:31:30] Speaker B: For that. Like, see, here's an example where I was like, yeah, he's always drawn as a retriever. I love retrievers. There's a picture of my old golden retriever right behind me. Like, I'm not, like, hung up on Crypto's weight or size or fur as a determinant for. For this movie. [00:31:46] Speaker A: For me, imagine he would have been a pit bull. I would have been like, oh, snap. Crypto the pit bull. Forget about it. You know, but the fact that he's going to be there at all is a distraction. I mean, he's supposed to show up in Supergirl, right? He made it another bigger part in that. [00:32:03] Speaker B: He's supposed to have a bigger part in that. [00:32:04] Speaker A: Oh, right. Why not? And mid credit scene, end credit scene. I don't know. Do that as a vehicle for that so that we can be like, okay, what happens next? Yeah, we got to see him. And. And we trying to connect with the Superman that you're giving us, Brian. [00:32:24] Speaker B: Well, that's why I draw the dog pool analogy, right? Because if you go back to that movie, how many slow mo shots does. Do they give dog pool? Like four. It's a lot, right? Like, the first one, you're kind of like, oh, that's cute and funny. By the third or fourth one, you're like, really? Again, like, you know, so that's where we ask the question how much crypto. [00:32:42] Speaker A: Here is where I think it works. I've never owned a dog, but I'm sure people who own dogs like talking, just speaking out loud their thoughts with their dog. You know what they're thinking. And that'll be a moment for Superman to speak to the audience about what he's thinking about. How whatever situation. And his dog is the only person that's with him and he's talking to him about it and we're listening in. Pretty much that's the only reason that it works for me. I just don't want to spend time chasing this dude and having the smartest man in the world going after him, you know, that's my take on it. [00:33:24] Speaker B: I think odds are relatively low. That would be my guess. My guess is. My guess is he's in it in shots like this, which are sort of like panoramics. They're sort of moments, you know, they're not really like full on scenes. I would be shocked. [00:33:38] Speaker A: Does that aspect work then when I just lay down? [00:33:41] Speaker B: Yeah, like, I think so. The mind. The mind of Kal El. [00:33:44] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:33:44] Speaker B: And this idea that, like, this is a conversation they've had for years because they spent that time together. Sure. Of course, that was the like visual one. But we finally got James Gunn talking about the movie, which is funny if you think about it. For all the time he spends on socials, he usually kind of gives you like a one word answer, one sentence answer. So finally, at New York Comic Con, he talked about the film itself. And of course, he's in hype mode. The quote, the movie is going extraordinarily well. We're deep in the process of editing. David Corn Sweat is going to blow the people. Blow people the f away. He is the movie star that everyone dreams he could possibly be. And I don't think anyone understands the depth of this guy's talent. Dramatically and comedically, he's the best physical action star I've probably ever worked. He's an amazing actor. And Rachel Brosnahan, people are going to die for her as Lois, end quote. [00:34:40] Speaker A: Brian, he's speaking what we've spoken when these announcements came to light. It doesn't surprise me is. It actually excites me somewhat. But I expect him to say what he's saying. [00:34:52] Speaker B: Sure. [00:34:54] Speaker A: So, but when these announcements, this. The excitement that we had when those announcements were made, Brian, we've had them already. I just want to see something. [00:35:05] Speaker B: So to that point, he said, quote, there's no trailer yet. It won't be too long, but it won't be soon. Quote, so cryptic on that. So I guess you could say by Christmas. I don't know. That's what he's sort of saying. Maybe, maybe. I don't think it would be. I interpret that to be like, you wouldn't like super bowl would be too far out. So probably saying Halloween is Too soon. So I would say probably somewhere around Christmas. I don't know what their. I couldn't think of an obvious flagship property for him to attach it to. So we'll see what they do. But that seems to be what he's saying to your point about seeing it. And yes, you would expect him to be a hype man for his cast for sure, but it's the first time he said anything about. [00:35:42] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. And I expect whatever he's feeling, I expect to see that on screen. Any other announcements for Superman? [00:35:53] Speaker B: Oh, he did also say Super Girl is filming by the end of October in England. [00:36:01] Speaker A: Starts the film, correct? [00:36:03] Speaker B: Oh, yes. [00:36:04] Speaker A: Okay. Okay. Okay. Brian, I keep thinking about that show we did months ago, because that is the topic that we have to sort of touch on. Brian, when it comes to what sort of success are you looking for? Because based on the hit, based on history, that no matter what name you throw out up on the screen there, it doesn't reflect in terms of the success you want. Therefore, we get no sequels franchises. None of that. [00:36:39] Speaker B: We're talking about female led superhero and action franchise type films. It has been challenging at the box office in general. [00:36:48] Speaker A: Yes. But certainly, Brian, you and I are excited and some. And Tracy, all these dudes are excited about seeing this movie. Why? For me, a little bit it has to do with the. The atrocity that was the first one. Right. So we saw sort of visually what that would. What that looks like Supergirl and how it didn't hit the scene, but based on the storyline and I guess the praise that that storyline has gotten and the people behind it. Brian, again, the team surrounding this project makes this project, for those people waiting for something like this, very excited to see. [00:37:36] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, there's reasons for optimism and obviously everyone that makes one of these now is going to be holding up Patty Jenkins. Wonder Woman from a financial perspective as the. What is possible, $800 million out of the. Out of the gate, albeit, as we said, in sort of peak superhero fanfare time. But yeah, look, I mean, I think Millie Alcock's ratings, to the extent that people know her, is very high from House of the Dragon. I think the storyline of Woman of Tomorrow offers interesting potential because it is not a hokey, goofy type of Supergirl story. It has a chance to be more raw, to offer the character more range, to be morally questionable en route to redemption. Sort of a good buddy type movie stuff. So we'll see. I mean, it has potential, but as we've discussed, there's just. There are a lot of precedents for even when stuff is well received, as recent example, Furiosa critically well received audiences oftentimes do not come out the same way for these types of projects as they do for others. [00:38:45] Speaker A: We're certainly looking forward to seeing this movie, whether it's a success for dc. I mean, let's see. Let's see. I would hope so. [00:38:54] Speaker B: I think a significant portion of its potential rides on Superman. [00:38:59] Speaker A: Everything right else. [00:39:01] Speaker B: Right. We know that. But I'm saying this in particular is sort of like Superman is dead on arrival. [00:39:06] Speaker A: Then they might as well send this. [00:39:07] Speaker B: One straight to Max. I'm serious. Might as well back girl. It like. It just. It's just not. I'm just saying, like, it's not gonna work if Superman is bad or people just don't care and nobody shows up. Not suddenly going to be like, aha, I'm showing up for this. [00:39:23] Speaker A: One last thing before we move on. Are they any other announcements that you want to talk about? [00:39:28] Speaker B: I mean, they showed a Creature Commandos trailer. [00:39:31] Speaker A: We could talk about that. Yeah. But before we move on to that one thing, Brian, why Supergirl works and Batgirl really doesn't really work. Supergirl's Kryptonian and she got power. Batgirl doesn't. And we. It just is. Remember again, if you go back to that show Br, we talk about believability, that she's capable of doing some of the things that she's capable of doing with Supergirl. It's believable. Why? Because she's Kryptonian. And I think that makes a difference. Brian, who does? [00:40:10] Speaker B: I mean, you saw like Sasha Calle in the Flash. I mean, some of those scenes are some of the better scenes in the movie. [00:40:15] Speaker A: Exactly, exactly. People talking about this, why she's not Supergirl. Whatever. People were talking about that, but she died in the movie. So, you know, what are you talking about here? So those possibilities make it possible for success to come to these. To these movies. Although that doesn't necessarily say that women have to have powers in order for something to be successful. Because I have ideas, Brian, that I think if I were able to pitch someone, I think it could work. Creature Commandos, Brian, do you think the animation changed a little bit? Was a little bit. Was updated. [00:40:54] Speaker B: I thought it looked a little tighter in this trailer. [00:40:56] Speaker A: I agree. [00:40:57] Speaker B: Showing the more of the action. But I was like, it looks a little more put together. It looked better. [00:41:04] Speaker A: Yes, yes, yes, exactly. Exactly. I thought the same thing. One of the things, Brian, that when I saw, when I keep seeing the trailer for it and when I think about Creature Commandos is everything else we've seen thus far in terms of TV and I guess film with Suicide Squad, in terms of the team aspect with weird characters, Doom Patrol, Umbrella Academy, Suicide Squad as well. Those things just spark my memory. So your thoughts on what you thought of it? I mean, I'm interested in seeing it. I'm not interested. I don't know if you've seen Brian Zack Snyder's Gods, the Animated show or animated movie. [00:42:00] Speaker B: I'm aware of it, but no, I haven't seen it. [00:42:03] Speaker A: Don't waste your time. [00:42:06] Speaker B: I still haven't watched all of the extended cuts of Rebel Moon, so I. [00:42:11] Speaker A: Didn'T even know it was out, Brian. [00:42:13] Speaker B: Neither did anyone else. I don't think it barely cracked the top 10 in Netflix. You know what? The one thing with Creature Commandos, I'll watch it, obviously. Yeah, you've got some. You got some good vocal talent. You know, you bring back Viola Davis, Rick this, Rick Flag. That's the one thing like Frank Grillo is. Yes, kind of everywhere. Right. He's sort of in Peacemaker, he's in Superman, he's in Voicing in this. So that character apparently has a real sort of pivotal cameo to starring role. There is a feeling in my mind when I watch this of the show is a little late. I was trying to imagine if this trailer had hit Respect late in the sense that the bar for animated superhero has gone so far up last two years that I was trying to think about, like, if this trailer hit prior to Invincible coming out, how would I feel? And I think the answer is I would feel much more interested and kind of almost jarred by the violence the way it appears, but because sort of Invincible has made hyperviolence really part of the story in an amazing way. And then Blue Eye Samurai kind of made its violence into sort of like this artistic masterpiece. And Then X Men 97, which isn't quite as bloody, but kind of brought the storytelling into. And then even Caped Crusader, which we kind of were like, hey, Cape Crusader. Kind of felt a little bit almost like a letdown at points because of these other shows. I think this show falls into that category. [00:43:53] Speaker A: It's just there to be there. [00:43:55] Speaker B: Like, it's not bad. I think it could be interesting. The standard by which I view a show like this has changed completely now measured by X Men 97 and Blue Eyed Samurai. And that's just an Invincible like. And those shows are just up there. [00:44:08] Speaker A: Yeah, I agree 100%. Nonetheless, we're looking forward to seeing it. [00:44:15] Speaker B: Yeah. I should even say, you know, the other thing that came out, which we haven't really discussed, but maybe after part two comes out, we'll go back, is the HBO Watchmen animated movie, which. Which I think Part two, Red Band trailer hit the other day, and that's another one that looks spectacular, is true to the comic. And you're kind of like, these are all kind of changing the game. [00:44:33] Speaker A: You know, I want to see the. [00:44:35] Speaker B: Year where we go to the animated Emmys and every nominee is from our genre, because I think it can happen. [00:44:41] Speaker A: It can. Exactly, Brian. It can. It certainly can do that. It certainly can do that. He's done it, you know, in comics, in terms of written. Written for him, Right? [00:44:53] Speaker B: Yep. [00:44:53] Speaker A: And we can do it here, and that would be so dope. But there's a standard we gotta uphold, you know what I'm saying? And. And do things purposely, not just to do it. Brian, your thoughts on James Gunn saying everything is his own thing. [00:45:09] Speaker B: Oh, visually comment, no. [00:45:12] Speaker A: Visually, yes. [00:45:13] Speaker B: Yeah. So you want to do that. You want to do the anti Marvel part of this now? Because he has two. He has two direct shots at the mcu. [00:45:21] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. [00:45:21] Speaker B: You can't figure out what he's saying. So one is, he says that they are not binding the creators to a single visual aesthetic. That creators are allowed to build worlds within their world and they don't have to look the same. Which is clearly a shot at the MCU's kind of homogenous color palette. Like 100%. That's what he's talking about. [00:45:45] Speaker A: Got it. [00:45:45] Speaker B: And then someone asked him about release date, calendar, and they kind of said, you know, will DC get to the point where they're putting out three movies a year? Which is kind of what Marvel's kind of been that three, four movies a year. And his quote was, that was never under consideration. And they're basically at one to two a year right now. [00:46:04] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:46:05] Speaker B: That feels like Marvel did it wrong and oversaturated. And we're not going to do that. [00:46:10] Speaker A: Yeah. Until you get the pressure of Zaslav not pounding at the door like, hey, I want more. [00:46:17] Speaker B: Yeah. I mean, I think it's really simply put, whenever the Superman teaser hits, that will change the discussion about this entire universe. Right now we're having a great discussion about Penguin talking about that side of the world. We just had the black eye of Joker 2, but I think when the Superman teaser hits, everything else kind of goes to the backseat and we just start talking about, this is it. This is getting Real. Yeah. [00:46:41] Speaker A: Brian. So this episode wasn't really entirely on the back of. What's her name again? [00:46:52] Speaker B: Kristen Milioti. [00:46:54] Speaker A: She. [00:46:54] Speaker B: Brian is Emmy in one episode. [00:47:00] Speaker A: Put her at the top of the list alongside with obviously Penguin and his performance and, you know, but Brian 1 and 2. Imagine Colin Farrell and she win Emmys, Sure. For the performance. That would be dope. But Brian. Yeah, she carried this show on her back. We really gotta. The emotions that you are on while watching this in terms of the feelings you have towards her character. Because initially it was like, this girl is crazy. And then you realize, oh, snap, I realize why. [00:47:51] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:47:53] Speaker A: And that's usually the time that people don't usually take to understand. Right. The why they just say, oh, snap, crazy. But the transformations that she was able to portray, Brian, in terms of, you know, she's still family, but she has her loyalty to her father and her feelings for her father. There's that sense of, you know, she, he's not only the boss, he's my father. Right. And her sort of, you know, sensible emotions in terms of just being a grown up, just living a normal life. Right. Until the betrayals. Brian. Until the. Until the realization. Brian. And the things that she has to go through. And now we understand who she is somewhat. Your thoughts, Brian, on that episode of the Penguin? [00:49:01] Speaker B: I thought this episode was incredible. It was disturbing. I thought it was well conceived. I thought it was the perfect example of how you use the television medium to provide the kind of backstory that a movie often doesn't let you. And it. This show is doing a masterful job of making its diabolical leads seem like sympathetic figures. And in this episode, right, she goes from being like just a sort of the sadistic loon to like, oh, she's actually as much the victim as she is the perpetrator, such that when she exacts her revenge, you're rooting for it. You're like, I get it. I get why you got to that place with these people because of how they've done you over the past 10 years. But I did want to lead with Arkham. To me, this was the most fully realized version of Arkham that you could possibly have. [00:50:04] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:50:05] Speaker B: If you were going to do Arkham for real, it is not goofy, it is not happy, it is not silly. It is a place for the deranged and the psychotic, and the staff are as twisted as the inmates. And so it was outright disturbing to see her be tortured kind of in the way she was. But I think it was effective in putting you inside that world and leading to this place of when she does finally snap and kind of turn and you start to see her lose her grasp on. And she did a great job. I thought of holding out. I thought Milioti did a great job of keeping her innocence and keeping her humanity early in her stint. And then finally she kind of is broken by the institution. [00:50:55] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:50:56] Speaker B: So I loved that manifestation of that part of the Batman world that everyone knows. But I feel like most shows and movies have kind of shied away from the guts of it. They use it as a set. They use it as like a character entry, but they are not willing to show you Arkham. Like even Chris Nolan, which made Arkham seem very dark and, you know, gray. And he didn't really show you the inner workings of the Asylum itself. And this show did. And I really appreciate that we can. [00:51:25] Speaker A: Sort of say that the possibility of an outcome series. And I know there is perhaps on the discussion that this will probably get done because of that world being so intriguing, Brian. This world being so intriguing that Matt Reeves has created. And I'll be there to watch it because you can do some really interesting things there, Brian, from the perspective of the people that work there. You can. This is. Right. There's gold there. [00:51:54] Speaker B: Yeah. That one doctor in particular. People are suspecting Dr. Rush. They're kind of suspecting. That's a code name for. I think Hugo Strange is the betting money, but that he's something else. And there were some Batman Easter eggs. Right. Magpie is a sort of a lower level Batman villain, I think. I think she shared a cell with Poison Ivy at one point. So there's some. There's some Easter eggs in this episode along those lines as well. I definitely think I walked out of this episode. And by the way, I thought the revenge at the end was exquisitely executed, like the sequencing. Because you knew when she popped up dressed to the nines at the dinner, you're like, these guys are all screwed. How is this going to happen? And I kept waiting for the blood bath, the actual blood bath. But she was two steps ahead, killing all these guys. Spoiler alert. [00:52:43] Speaker A: It would be dope if she was Poison Ivy on the low, but. [00:52:47] Speaker B: Well, it made me. It may be. This episode made me a little sad in the sense that it made me more convinced she's not making it out of this season. But I really want her in The Batman Part 2. I really want her in the world as this, like, unpredictable force that can kind of come and go in sort of the criminal underworld. I wish There was a way for that to happen, but I don't. It just. The way they're setting this character up, it just seems impossible for both Oz and her to coexist, to emerge from this season. [00:53:17] Speaker A: Yeah, let us know in the comment section below. [00:53:20] Speaker B: I had one note. [00:53:21] Speaker A: Okay, one note. [00:53:23] Speaker B: For this, the episode, I wanted one scene in the cafeteria where a couple of the inmates were talking about how they got there. That's what I wanted. Because we know how they got there and we know who put them there. And I just wanted one little, like, they don't say by name. Just these crazy people talking and bitching about this creature of the night. [00:53:49] Speaker A: Brian, what have I been saying to you? Brian, what have I been saying to you? I've been saying that his aura at least needs to be there. At least I mentioned Batman is a problem for these people. Yo. And no mention of him. [00:54:12] Speaker B: Yeah, I wanted that one. It wasn't even. It didn't even have to be involving her. It could have been like. You just overhear other inmates basically being like, this dude's crazier than us and he's on the outside and we're on the inside. Like, just something like lamenting, but nothing his existence. And they didn't do it. And I was like, it was there. It was there for. [00:54:30] Speaker A: But that's how good the show was. [00:54:32] Speaker B: Yeah. Oh, totally. The show was still a 10 out of 10. But it was like. There was that moment where I was like, you could have done it and it would have been like, aha, he's out there and he's why you're all in here. [00:54:43] Speaker A: But that's what I've been saying, you know, there's no mention of it, but yet things are happening. And it's fine. The performances are great at all. Everything is fantastic. But that little piece, like, if you had to. If you told me five out of five, I wouldn't give it a five out of five. I would give it a four and a half. And just. And it's just because of that. [00:55:03] Speaker B: I also will rewind a little bit because we didn't talk in full about episode three, the Vic episode, which I thought was also outstanding. Yeah. One of my favorite sequences, because it ties to Sophia, is Colin Farrell with tears in his eyes, connecting with Sophia right before they get. They get a gun put to their head. And then Vic comes in with the car and gets in the car and. [00:55:26] Speaker A: He says, leave her. [00:55:27] Speaker B: That is one of my favorite, like, two minute swings. I was like, that's that penguin right there. [00:55:33] Speaker A: What we are looking forward to seeing and trying to figure out is how this dude is going to talk his way out of this if they. If there's talk to be had. Brian. Because we already know that she's going to be at him and he's got to defend himself or have to go after her and. And try to do something because now he has both of the families after him. [00:55:59] Speaker B: Yep. [00:56:00] Speaker A: Which is a problem. So how does he. I don't know. Brian. And. And we already seen from the trailers for the. The next set of episodes. [00:56:13] Speaker B: Yep. [00:56:15] Speaker A: Oz's personal life is going to like his real private personal life. Things that he considers valuable in his life will be compromised. And that's going to be interesting to see where this goes. Brian. So, yeah, let us know in the comments below what you guys think of the Penguin thus far in that episode and the performances there. Man. And the missing piece. It's gonna be a missing piece. There's beautiful pieces of art that miss that have that little piece that's missing. Does it make it valueless? No. But that piece was. It could have made it, you know, everything. Let's move on. Brian. Into the Marvel world. Spider Man 4. Brian. If I were Marvel, I just wouldn't send this dude nothing. Brian. Don't send it. But they have to, right? Because is like if he asks for it, they have to send them. They're not going to tell him no. You. You know who you're talking to. That's what happens. That's what happens. So they got to send them the first draft. Right? And who cares, Brian, about a first draft? We shouldn't care as the audience. We shouldn't care how we can get updates. But not your take on the first draft, yo. [00:57:59] Speaker B: Yeah. Signed the writers of Blade. What draft are we on? What script are we on? Yeah. [00:58:07] Speaker A: Why are we talking about drafts? Yo. It almost feel like playoffs. [00:58:12] Speaker B: Playoffs? Don't talk about playoffs. You kidding me? [00:58:16] Speaker A: But Brian, what's the latest? Tom Holland reading the script and him jumping for joy. [00:58:22] Speaker B: Quote, we have a creative and a pitch and a draft which is excellent. It needs work, but the writers are doing a great job. I read it three weeks ago and it really lit a fire in me. Zendaya and I sat down and read it together. And we at times were bouncing around the living room like, this is a real movie worthy of Fans respect. Chris McKenna, Eric Summers, the scribes from no Way Home are writing it. [00:58:48] Speaker A: Okay. Which is important. [00:58:51] Speaker B: Filming next May in England. [00:58:58] Speaker A: All we can say is, we'll see. I don't trust Anything that Tom Holland really says in terms of whatever. In terms of that. [00:59:05] Speaker B: He said something else that was funny, too. He said something about pitching ideas to the studio. He said he gave them some notes. [00:59:14] Speaker A: There's no some notes. Yeah, of course. [00:59:16] Speaker B: And then. And then he's like. He's like, you know, what's really cool is you have to find the exact quote. It's out there. He's like. He's like, what's really cool is they always have this vision. And so, like, when I pitch them an idea, they're like, nah, you can't do that because we already doing that in Captain America 4. [00:59:36] Speaker A: It's like, you're not in the room, buddy. You're not where the sausage is being made. You get in the already made Patty. What you do with it after that. The technique is what you know, is. [00:59:49] Speaker B: That the Kevin Feige equivalent of shut up and dribble. [00:59:56] Speaker A: But whatever, whatever respect to him, because he's given us a great trilogy and all his appearances have been fantastic. Right. [01:00:05] Speaker B: I mean, it does confirm that. Look, I mean, as we suspected and we had this discussion, Zendaya is in the movie, clearly, right? If he's referencing. They're reading it together, how much she's in the movie and what her role is in the movie. That's the tv, right? And that's what the rumor has been, sort of this idea that they're casting for another female lead might suggest. And maybe it's Black Cat. But anyway, his quote would tell you at least the idea that Zendaya is not in the movie. Not happening. She's in the movie, so. [01:00:33] Speaker A: They got to keep that. I equate the sort of relationship that they have, Ryan, to the peak of Twilight, you know what I'm saying? Their relationship in terms of the interest the audience has with it. [01:00:58] Speaker B: You mean between both actor and character. [01:01:01] Speaker A: Correct? [01:01:02] Speaker B: Yes, I would agree. That's a good enough. [01:01:04] Speaker A: Gotta keep that going. They gotta keep that going because you're in this dilemma now where she doesn't know him and he's gonna now have to win her over. How does he do that? He's Spider Man. She knows who Spider man is in terms of that. Spider Man, Right. That's as far as she knows. [01:01:23] Speaker B: I think the other thing, to your point, her star power has risen. His has not. So if you look at challengers and if you look at Dune. Right, The Z, she's growing. She's not shrinking. Right. She took Euphoria, parlayed it into big screen superstardom. [01:01:41] Speaker A: Yes, yes. [01:01:42] Speaker B: He's Spider Man. His attempts. Now, in fairness, Uncharted made some money. I'm not gonna tell you that's a zero. But he has not been able to translate his role as Peter Parker into Tom Holland, mega movie star, headline other projects in the way that she had. [01:01:59] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:02:00] Speaker B: So they need her in these projects to sell them, man. It would be maybe the most Sony thing ever if they basically wrote her out of somehow. But one of these next two movies, and you're like, yeah, that's why you're Sony and that's why you do the. You know. But anyway, she'll be in the movie. It's just a question how much she's in the movie. [01:02:19] Speaker A: Yeah, but it's too early to talk about first drafts, man. And where this movie is at. We still don't know. We still hope that they don't go multiverse on us. Crazy Brian. [01:02:33] Speaker B: So there's still stuff out there that makes me think this is not totally unre, unresolved, and it relates to Venom. But I will say, tongue in cheek. There's at least a 33% chance that they gave him a fake draft. Given his history of spilling stuff. [01:02:46] Speaker A: Perfect. [01:02:46] Speaker B: There's at least a 33% chance of what he read. [01:02:51] Speaker A: That the possibility that that's the case is out. [01:02:54] Speaker B: Yeah, exactly. They fed him an AI. They fed him a chat GPT version, and they're writing the real one. [01:03:01] Speaker A: And he's like, what are we doing? I thought this was. No, no, no, no, no. But yeah. Let us know in the comment section below what you guys think of the latest body for updates. Venom. Brian, anything you want to add to? [01:03:17] Speaker B: Let's connect it. Let's connect it. Because Venom Last Dance is coming out. Box office is tracking kind of mid last. I saw opening weekend, 70 million US which would be the lowest of the three. Haven't seen any reviews yet, but Tom Hardy obviously asked about the character making the publicity rounds. And I'll do the Spider man part first, and then we'll come back to the rest. So he says, quote, I'd love to fight Spider Man. I'd love to fight him now. I'm happy to fight spider man today. 100%. And I would never say never. And then his director, Kelly Marcel, says, while the plot for Eddie and Venom closes, there are lots of symbiote stories in the canon, lots of places to go, and maybe a few Easter eggs in here that might start the journey off. End quote. I mean, they're definitely dropping a few hints. And we've known this for A while. Sony wants Hardy and Holland in a movie together. [01:04:12] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah. [01:04:13] Speaker B: And Spider Man 4 would seem like the most. That's the obvious place for it to happen. It doesn't necessarily square with friendly neighborhood Spider man street level story. But I don't see any way we get out of this next couple of years without Hardy and Holland being on screen together at some point. So the question is when and where it happens. [01:04:31] Speaker A: Yeah. That's their job to figure it out, isn't it? [01:04:36] Speaker B: Could be Secret wars, too. I mean, you could always do that. Like you'd always bring them together that way. [01:04:41] Speaker A: I guess the genesis of actually the Symbiote thing. Secret Wars. But I guess they'll make it the genesis of Meat. Right? But what happens after Secret wars is my big question. Right? [01:04:53] Speaker B: Yeah. It feels a little forced if he's in Spider Man 4 coming off of no Way Home. But obviously in the credit. We've already seen that one credit credits scene. Right. Where the symbiote, where he crossed over effectively. And yes, they were in the same universe, so. [01:05:06] Speaker A: Yes, yes. Yeah. [01:05:09] Speaker B: Seems like this will happen in some. Some capacity. [01:05:12] Speaker A: One last thing, Brian. Gladiator 2. You want to talk about that? [01:05:20] Speaker B: Are you excited for Venom? Are you gonna see it? I'll see it. [01:05:24] Speaker A: Venom 2 was such a disappointment, Brian. For me, Venom 2 was just such a disappointment, Ryan. That I'll go because my son will want to see it. [01:05:36] Speaker B: Okay. [01:05:37] Speaker A: Not because I want to see it. I'll go because of him. [01:05:40] Speaker B: Because they've got this God of the Symbiotes character that they keep teasing now in the trailers and they're kind of saying that character is going to show up in the future. Where's that going? I don't know. [01:05:50] Speaker A: He's. That he's. You know who he is. He's the character in. What's that character that showed up at the last five minutes of Black Adam, the Raw character. He's that equivalent to that. [01:06:02] Speaker B: Okay. [01:06:04] Speaker A: An enemy that we don't care about. He's the third act of Wonder Woman. We don't care. [01:06:12] Speaker B: I just want to know where they think he's showing up in the. Like, what plans do they have for him? And they got Andy Serkis voicing him. And like, I don't know, who knows? But they're clearly saying this is the end of the Hardy trilogy, so I'll see it. But I. Yeah, yeah, yeah. My excitement is kind of moderate. I'm not. [01:06:31] Speaker A: My excitement is. I still have a bad taste from Benin too. [01:06:38] Speaker B: I agree with you. I Mean, the first one, again, 800 million poorly reviewed, but it's in that 2018. It's in that stretch where everything's making a ton of money. So I think it was overrated. Second one was like 500. That's probably more realistic. That's probably more representative of the character's success. And the third one sounds like it's going to track lower than that. So, you know, this thing does 350, like three. Is that. Is that a win or not? [01:07:00] Speaker A: It's supposed to go this way, not this way. You know what I'm saying? Because that's the whole point of getting into this, right? To do this. [01:07:13] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:07:14] Speaker A: To see the arrow go up. Yeah. You may get some dips along the way, but then. [01:07:18] Speaker B: But the trajectory down to the right is your. Squeeze it. Squeeze. Yeah. [01:07:24] Speaker A: Yo, squeezing the juice just to get a few extra few hundred million dollars. Okay. Yeah, I guess. Yeah. Right, right, right. But who cares about what the fans think? They just give it to them. They just. Let's just end the story. Hurry up, Brian. Gladiator 2. Brian. People, I keep hearing good things and. Brian. Not just good things, Brian. The fact that Denzel, regardless of what you think of Denzel Washington and him performing it, is still a performance that you have to see because it all depends on the words that you give him and how he expresses it. Brian. And that's what you're going to go see in Gladiator in a different time, Brian. That's what I think more people are sort of. Are we going to see Denzel Washington in. In. In ancient times? Are we going to see. [01:08:25] Speaker B: Yes, yes. Console Alonzo Harris. Yes. [01:08:30] Speaker A: But how he goes about it, Brian. I think will be. The nuances of it. Brian. Will. Will sway us into being like, yeah, he hasn't lost it. Brian. [01:08:45] Speaker B: You want the quote? [01:08:46] Speaker A: Yes. [01:08:47] Speaker B: So they did their first screening. Paramount is fired up about this movie, and they better be, because apparently it costs close to $400 million. [01:08:59] Speaker A: The motivation. [01:09:00] Speaker B: Yeah. But I guess if you. I guess if you really flood a replica Roman Coliseum and put alligators in it, maybe that does cost you some money. I don't know. Okay, so this is the reactions part. We know reactions are always up here and results are always a bit below. That's almost always the case. But the consensus is that it is a best picture contender. And that Denzel Washington quote from Dark Horizons, a shoe in for the supporting actor. Hey, Shoe in supporting actor Oscar. No one else need applause. [01:09:36] Speaker A: Wow. So some of the quotes. [01:09:39] Speaker B: Some of the quotes from the reactions that went public. Ridley Scott's best directorial efforts since Black Tyco Down. This is Denzel Washington having the time of his life in one of his most killer roles yet. And a third Oscar could very well come his way. Separate quote. Gladiator 2, a true epic. Ridley Scott's best in years. Paul Mescal, great action star without sacrificing his indie grit. Worthy heir to the throne. Denzel Washington eats every line and costume without ever overplaying. End quote. Next quote from actually a high profile criticism. Denzel Washington chews up the scenery quite a bit here and looks like he's having the time of his life. Next quote. Denzel stealing the movie and soon to be one of his most iconic performances. End quote. I don't see that from the trailer. I love Denzel. I will watch almost anything he's in and I will never bad. [01:10:31] Speaker A: But except for Fences, I didn't watch Fences. Too much complaining. [01:10:36] Speaker B: But Denzel and epic Denzel and biopic Denzel and drama Denzel and action to me, like is as reliable. Like I'll watch movies all day. I watch, I'll watch Unstoppable all day. These movies are just great to have on a plane, have on a desert island. And obviously then you have the Malcolm X, you have the glory, you have the stuff that, you know, Training Day, the stuff that kind of made him an icon. [01:11:00] Speaker A: But Hurricane, yeah. [01:11:01] Speaker B: Which yeah, you love more than I do. But I think the what they've shown in the trailer to me just doesn't fit this level of adoration. Not saying he's bad. It just seems like it is kind of. Yeah, it is kind of Training Day, Ancient Rome. Like it just seems like he's riffing on characters we've already seen him do as opposed to breaking new ground in this new era that he's in. And he's given his rationale. He said publicly, I don't think I could do the Numidian accent competently. So I just did New York because that's more me. He said it and great. Who's going to tell him? No, Ridley Scott included is not going to tell that. [01:11:44] Speaker A: So yeah, yeah, that's the run. That's the risk you take when you're getting these. You gotta get their interpretation right. Pretty much. Right. And if you don't want him to have an accent, Joaquin Phoenix, he doesn't get an accent. You know what I'm saying? But you get what you get. And it probably worked out for Denzel more than it gonna work out for. It worked out for Joaquin Phoenix. [01:12:10] Speaker B: So, I mean, if he's having fun and he's invested, like, again, you're not gonna take your eyes off him because he's Denzel Washington. He's one of the five. But, yeah, this idea that, I don't know, these quotes make it seem like he's, you know, reinventing the space. Like, I just. The trailer's not giving me that. It's more playing the hits. [01:12:32] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, Exactly. He's playing the hits. And he's gonna be just a performance. He's a performance. Those are performed. You know, you give him. You give him three words. He's gonna perform those three words, and he's gonna make it sound great. And that's what you're really. [01:12:48] Speaker B: Interesting interview. If you. He doesn't give a ton of them, but if you ever listen to him talk about his resume. [01:12:54] Speaker A: Mm. [01:12:55] Speaker B: He's as no bs he comes across as no BS Practical actor as I've ever heard. He literally is just like, whatever I did before is what I did. I don't think about it. Like, it's a job. I live in it. I get paid, and I move on. And then I do the next one. Like, he is like that athlete of, like, one game at a time, One game at a time. Like, that's how he portrays it. And I don't know if that's true, like, if that's truly how he lives it. But he really doesn't ever give you this sort of dramatic story of how he finds characters. To him, it's literally just like, it's a job I'm interested. And in this case, Ridley Scott is someone he knows, he's worked with, he's comfortable with. And he's like, I'm good. Give me the script. I'll be ready to roll. It's like. It's like ultimate professional, but not extra. That's how it comes across. [01:13:45] Speaker A: He's going to work because he's. He used to pick up garbage and he. And it was just going. And go do the job, and that's it. And I think that's a cool approach to have when you're doing this sort of work. And he's been doing it forever. And let's see how. Let's see what. I would like to see him in a romantic comedy. Brian, something different. Brian something just totally different. I would like to see that. But, yeah, Let us know in the comment section below what you guys think of the praise that Gladiator 2 is getting. Brian, It's. It's crazy. And that Denzel stealing the show. I wouldn't. I think, Brian, that here's the thing. He's the lead for a reason usually. And if you put him in a supporting role, it's hard for him not to steal the scene. Because he's a lead in a lot of movies. Brian. For a reason. Ryan. [01:15:01] Speaker B: When was the last time. When was the last time he was truly in a supporting role? I was thinking about that the other day. It's been a long time since he like, since he really said, I will be the defined number two or number three on this ticket and I will help get Paul Mescal over. Has it been since Glory? When was the last time he got game? He's still kind of the star of that. I mean, Ray Allen's the supporting character to his character. [01:15:34] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:15:35] Speaker B: So when is the last time? Because even in the movies where he's co. He's very co. Right. Like Unstoppable, it's him and Chris Pine, but he kind of is one the Pines 1A in taking Apellum 1, 2, 3. It's him and Travolta. [01:15:47] Speaker A: But it's. He's not. [01:15:49] Speaker B: Whoa. He's never. [01:15:52] Speaker A: He's never in a movie that you don't. You don't put his face on. And everybody think that's his movie. [01:15:56] Speaker B: Yeah. Like even like Philadelphia, it's him and Hanks like they're co. Like, yeah. American Gangster. Him and Russell. [01:16:04] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. [01:16:06] Speaker B: Has it been since Glory that he was legitimately like second or like third on the ticket? And I was literally trying to think of like, when was the last time he did this? [01:16:18] Speaker A: Because you almost get a sense of this movie feeling like people just looking at this movie like a Denzel movie. Right. [01:16:25] Speaker B: Think they're promoting it like that because he. Of his name. Right. Paul Mescal doesn't yet have the certain name and certain Gladiator. [01:16:33] Speaker A: Pascal would. [01:16:38] Speaker B: Yes. But I think Global. I mean Washington of the cast is the icon and I think the difference. Gladiator 1. Russell Crowe was already a megastar, so they could build it around him. Joaquin was the. The like up and comer in that movie. [01:16:57] Speaker A: Certainly. But after. It was only after LA Confidential. I mean, he was having a run up in terms of. I mean. Yeah, certainly he had a name. He said he did. He did. [01:17:08] Speaker B: Insider. I think he already had the. [01:17:10] Speaker A: But with Denzel, Brian, even if he's like third Bill, you put his face on it. It's already the association of him being. Because we're used to seeing him in as lead, you. You don't put Denzel in a mo. And he's third or fourth. You don't put him. If he shows up. If there's a trailer for a movie and he shows up, everybody will be like, surprised. Oh, snap. Denzel, right? Obviously. Right. But you go see it because of him and I. And I guess that's the reason why we're getting so much of him and so much talk of him and not so much of the others, even though I'm sure their performances are going to be fantastic. And we've heard good things about their performances as well. But Denzel is the ticket. [01:17:52] Speaker B: I would just suspect that his. Like, if you looked at his percentage of screen time in the trailer versus his percentage of screen time in the movie, I bet you less. The trailer is higher than the percentage in the movie. He's less than the trailer leads you to believe. And Mescal's in it a lot more. [01:18:08] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's why he steals the show when he does show up. [01:18:14] Speaker B: Probably in it more than the trailer would lead you to believe. [01:18:17] Speaker A: Yeah. That's why he showed. That's why. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But let us know in the comment section below what you guys think of the talk of the town, Denzel Washington, Gladiator 2, and the talk that he's the highlights. And not to say, Brian, they've also said that this movie doesn't really live up to the first one. But I'm not. I'm not looking at it like that, Brian, because how could you? [01:18:45] Speaker B: No, it's more. Yeah, yeah. [01:18:48] Speaker A: I have more of a concern. If you've watched our shows before, you can hear our concerns about this movie and where it's going. But we still hear the contrary. [01:18:57] Speaker B: But consider the story was much better than the first. They clearly heard the. They heard the complaints about the soundtrack. [01:19:04] Speaker A: There you go. [01:19:05] Speaker B: Complaints about how unfocused it was. So if nothing else, the promotion is tight, tightened up. Yes, it was better. I think. It's funny, really. Scott was saying he's already writing Gladiator 3. I'm like, oh, excited about it. I'm like, we're doing that. [01:19:18] Speaker A: Let's see. Let's see what the box office says about that. [01:19:21] Speaker B: Exactly, Exactly. [01:19:23] Speaker A: But, yeah, let us know in the comment section below what you guys think of all this. Thank you for the 1K subscribers we've gotten. We just here to talk about stuff that we care passionately about, and we want to. We want to avoid pitfalls, you know, and we want to continue this, this, this seeing these, these characters of on screen and on TV and animation, whatever, and just, just see those, that, that genre continue. But thank you once again. Remember to hit that like and subscribe button. Hit that notification bell and we'll see you next time on the Nerd J Report. The show goes on.