Gladiator 2: Worth the Wait or Letdown?

[00:00:00] Speaker A: What up, everybody? And welcome back to another episode of the Nerd Gen Report. I'm your host, Pablo, and joining me, as always, is Mr. Brian Schultz. I saw it last night, Gladiator 2. He saw it this morning. It took me some time to sort of process what I just saw, to sort of really understand because again, this movie follows along similar beats as its predecessor. We'll talk about, I guess, some of the things people have said prior to the film coming out and what people have said after. My wife was asking me because she was really looking forward to seeing this movie as well. We saw it last. We saw that at one of the. I pick theaters. And she asked, what's up? What's Rotten Tomatoes Saying? I didn't want to look, but I figured it would be what it was. It was on 71%. And some of the things I have been hearing about it were that it wasn't as good as the first. It certainly had its highlights, but certainly. And some other disappointments. Brian. So let's get into it. What did you think of this movie? [00:01:13] Speaker B: I am glad it exists, but it's not necessary that it was made. That's kind of how I. That's my tagline. I think there's enough worthwhile here that I'm glad Ridley Scott went back to this well and attempted it. It is definitely not in the same class as the original. It's kind of uneven. There's as many, probably as many pros as cons as there will be in the discussion. [00:01:40] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:01:41] Speaker B: And while I think it would be a reasonable to entertaining watch for most people, I do not think it will be a repeat view and it certainly will not be a classic that lasts the test of time the way the original did. [00:01:56] Speaker A: I think it will be, though, when it's on. You'll see the Paul Mescal performance. [00:02:03] Speaker B: Well, he's in the pro column. We'll get to that. He's in the pro column in a way that goes beyond this film. And I think there's a lot of conversation around his choice for this, which is actually ties into our genre a little bit because he chose this role over potentially another role he could have had from Marvel. [00:02:25] Speaker A: Oh, okay. [00:02:26] Speaker B: And the timing has changed to where it's no longer the scheduling conflict it was. It was supposed to be. But it is an interesting sliding doors moment within this film that you see play out. We are in this time where a lot of movies are being revisited decades after the fact. Like, I guess I kind of lens this one more along the lines of like A Top Gun Maverick, where it's like the original was a classic. They left it be. It didn't need a sequel. And then they coaxed the P. The key people involved to come back and revisit the story. And I think Maverick will probably always stand the test of time as maybe the gold standard for pulling this off. [00:03:10] Speaker A: Bad. [00:03:10] Speaker B: Terminal 2 could maybe even topping the original 30 some odd years later. [00:03:14] Speaker A: Yeah. Bad in Terminator 2. [00:03:16] Speaker B: Well, that's only seven years. And that's a true sequel with Cameron. Always wanted. [00:03:21] Speaker A: God, I got it. Got it. [00:03:22] Speaker B: He wanted to do Terminator 2 as Terminator 1 and he didn't have the tech or the money. He's always said that. So. So I guess my question to you is, are you glad we have this movie? Like, would you feel better today if Ridley Scott had never made this? Or do you feel happy that there is a Gladiator 2 that you got to see? [00:03:41] Speaker A: I had always said that. We also have discussed way back when, when it was even first rumored of why this needed to be done or even discussed. Right. If you listen to. Not listen, but if you read. There's some articles out there about Ridley Scott wanting to do Gladiator 2 sometime after the first one and Russell Crowe wanted to come back somehow, but they can never make it work. You can read about it. Very interesting attempts in trying to bring him back. [00:04:15] Speaker B: The one through time is the most hilarious one. The Maximus resurrected. He goes throughout history to save the day in the future and the past. The Assassin's Creed style resurrection of Maximus. Saturday. Crazy script that's out there. [00:04:29] Speaker A: But having seen it yesterday, I'm glad it exists because of the performances. Listen, we'll get into it a little bit later about Denzel's performance, but they had this highlights. I'm not mad it exists. It does. One of the phrases in the movie echoes an eternity. This movie definitely echoes this. This first film. Again, I'm glad I saw it. But had I not seen it, I would have been fine. The way I thought about it when we first heard about it and that it. Hope it never gets made, but it's out there. I'm glad it exists. I'm. I was so disappointed in certain things that didn't happen in this film, Brian, that I was like, wow, they didn't even do that. I thought. I thought this was happening. It would have made more sense if it did. And some of the shots in the film, I don't know. For some reason suggested to me that there would be a possibility of that happening. And we'll get into that. How do you want. What do you want to talk about next? [00:05:34] Speaker B: Let's start with Mescal, because I would argue that he had the hardest job. Right. Because he took over not the same character, but he assumed the role. That one Russell Crowe, an Oscar in a Best Picture film. That is an almost impossible task for a young actor who's certainly up and coming, but it's not like he was sitting there with multiple Academy Award nominations of his own. This is the breakthrough moment for his career, the make or break moment, if you will. I thought he was outstanding. [00:06:11] Speaker A: Yes. Yes. I was talking to my brother because he's a big Gladiator fan as well, and he saw it. I think Thursday he said, I can't wait. I will see it. And he saw it. And that was one of his biggest takeaways, that Paul Mesko did a fantastic job. And I. And I came away thinking the same thing. And what I came out of it thinking or hoping to see him in future projects soon. [00:06:40] Speaker B: What I probably liked the most now, I did not think his character was written quite as perfectly as Russell Crowe's was. [00:06:48] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:06:48] Speaker B: In terms of the motivations, the driving force, the propulsion throughout the movie, Mescal's character has a little more twists and turns that are. There's a few moments that are tough to buy, quite honestly. His pivot around. And we're in spoiler territory, folks. So his pivot around the Peyro Pascal character comes pretty quick considering what his. [00:07:07] Speaker A: Yes. [00:07:07] Speaker B: Years long. What is what his motivation is for hunting him in the first place. He kind of comes around awfully quickly, but what I liked was he did not attempt to be Russell Crowe. [00:07:18] Speaker A: No. [00:07:19] Speaker B: His affect and his style are different. He's not a general. [00:07:24] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:07:25] Speaker B: And so I liked that he carved out a lane where I will not look at this film and say, oh, well, that's like Russell Crowe light. I didn't really find myself. I found myself viewing him as his own character pretty early in the film. And I think that's a very satisfying thing that he achieved. [00:07:42] Speaker A: So there was one similarity between him and Russell Crowe's performance and it was his camaraderie with other soldiers. One of the things you mentioned about him not being a general, the line. I think it was, you look upon me to speak. I do not know what to say. Something like that. I don't know. [00:08:04] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:08:04] Speaker A: That. You know. But that was cool. And I gotta say, I got. I. And I was thinking. I told my wife while this was happening. This is Jake Paul versus Tyson back then, like, what are we doing here? This is no. You know what I'm saying? So it wasn't as satisfying of a defeat and ending, but whatever. It's like, whatever. You know what? There was one thing that I was like, damn, I wish they would have done it this way, you know, with Cicero, when he. Maximus sent Cicero to go get his army. Yeah. [00:08:46] Speaker B: A recurring theme in this franchise, by the way. Like armies in Ostia having a tough time getting back to Rome. [00:08:53] Speaker A: So, yeah, it was 60 years. They're still over there. So he sends it. So we, you see, sort of like the payoff of that mission in this one. But when he asked who should I say sent me, they should have cut and not have him say who. And they should have just waited for that reveal when he delivered the message. That, that's I, I, I thought would have been a. Not necessarily a powerful moment. Order changed the mood a little bit. You know what I saying? [00:09:25] Speaker B: I would agree. So Mescal's affect, his physicality. [00:09:32] Speaker A: Oh, yes. [00:09:32] Speaker B: His anger. So he wins for all of that. As I said, the believability of the character is a little more uneven. And the reason I say that is the original one saved itself a lot of time by making Maximus a general. Because when he becomes a gladiator, the fact that everyone knows he's a general immediately puts him in a position to command and have people follow him. And so this character seemed to gain that through just killing the monkey. [00:10:04] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:10:05] Speaker B: And it's a little less believable that, like, everyone's rallying to him that quickly, in my eyes. [00:10:12] Speaker A: Well, if you can, I mean, you can argue that he was the most vocal out of all of them to really give directions as to what they should expect and no one else did. So I guess that being able to survive made him that natural choice for them to follow. [00:10:31] Speaker B: What I couldn't figure out which could. [00:10:33] Speaker A: He didn't earn that Maximus part. That Maximus, everybody. He didn't earn that, I don't think. Yes. [00:10:37] Speaker B: However, the one thing that wasn't made clear that could have answered that was how many of the people that were in this group of gladiators were part of the Numidian defense already. Right. Because they took prisoners from that city, not just him. [00:10:53] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:10:53] Speaker B: So then I was like, well, wait, are these men, Were these men also on the walls in Numidia? In which case he was already their commander, in which case they would follow him. But then they showed a couple of the guys in the arena, like, when they were fighting the Rhinoceros, who clearly didn't think anything of him and just. Just didn't listen to him. Then I was like, first one. [00:11:12] Speaker A: Yes. [00:11:13] Speaker B: So some of them knew him and some of them didn't. I'm like, the movie explain that to you. So then I was like, okay, I get that he's the central inspirational figure, but I don't know that he automatically has the cred that Russell Crow did. Remember, was it. Was it Diamond Hansu who said you have to kill your name before he kills you in the first one? Right. He's like, already that famous among the. The slaves. [00:11:36] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:11:37] Speaker B: So anyway, that was a part where I was like, the writing. See, that's not Mescal's fault. It's just the writing makes the character a little on shakier ground. His ascent. [00:11:45] Speaker A: Yes. Had it been from the jump that we. That he already had this sort of crew. And then he's already. Then he's put in with another set of group who has. It's sort of, I guess, alpha male or leader. And he sort of has to win that over, win them over, and at the same time win the audience over. Right. And now he's able to do that. It was a worthy sequel with this guy playing, I would say. [00:12:10] Speaker B: Yeah. Well, this goes to. I mentioned believability, the second area where I feel like the movie let him down a little bit. He doesn't have the crew that Russell Crowe did. We had. We asked this question before the movie came out. There is no Diamond Hanzu. There is no Ralph Moeller. Those guys added something to the fabric of that first movie. There's no real Courtney Gladiator that you get to know. [00:12:33] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:12:34] Speaker B: It's just Rascal. [00:12:35] Speaker A: They added him later, though. Right. That kind of Diamond Hansu, dude. [00:12:40] Speaker B: When Russell Crowe first gets taken. [00:12:42] Speaker A: Yes. [00:12:43] Speaker B: As a. As. As a gladiator near death. Ralph Mueller, the big guy, is training the gladiators. [00:12:47] Speaker A: Yes. [00:12:48] Speaker B: There. Right. And then Hansu is already. He's one of the others. He's carrying Russell Crowe in the. When he's lying and still sort of. [00:12:55] Speaker A: Wounded, he's helping him heal. [00:12:56] Speaker B: Yes. The point is he's building those bonds within the gladiators that we see at a micro level. And in this, there is none of that. That character isn't there. Mescal doesn't have a buddy. And I kind of feel like the movie lacked that. He needed that. [00:13:10] Speaker A: Yes. They tried to save it. Like, they tried to do that towards the end, which was again, perhaps a little bit too late. [00:13:18] Speaker B: Yes. [00:13:18] Speaker A: Right. You Mentioned his name. Diamond Hansu Brian. There was a. There was a gladiator next to him. Big, big black dude, ball head. They sort of shot. They sort of focused the camera on him. A couple, a few, a few too many times would led me to. To think that perhaps this is his son or something. [00:13:41] Speaker B: Yeah, I had the same thought. I was looking for a connection to that character. It's funny you say that, but it's. [00:13:46] Speaker A: Like they wasted the shot on this guy for no reason. You know, I was waiting for Diamond House. Whose character did it come out? [00:13:53] Speaker B: And weirdly to your point, Diamond Hunzo got the last line of Gladiator 1 where he said, we'll see you again, but not yet. That character of all characters probably needed like a little bit of a coda. Like what happened to that guy? [00:14:07] Speaker A: If you wanted to make that real connection, you bring that guy back because he's still around and he still looked the same. He could have been the guy telling him about his father. [00:14:17] Speaker B: Or depending on how you want to subvert it, he could have been Denzel's character. Maybe he breaks bad in the 16 years after. I'm just saying, like he would have been old enough. You're right. That character being the only surviving kind of co Gladiator from the first one. To not have any shred of his existence when they kind of dealt with almost everyone else who was left alive from the first movie is notable. [00:14:40] Speaker A: They wasted that. They wasted shots on that dude for no reason. I don't, I don't understand why they showed him so many times and it was like blatant to me. So the rumblings about Denzel was that this was an Oscar worthy performance. Brian, he may get. And I just have to say, respectfully. Respectfully, Denzel was doing Denzel and it was great. Right, But Oscar worthy? I don't think so. You know, I think he did. I chuckled at his way he delivered his lines because he just delivers it a certain way. He always does the, you know, like the drinks. You know, like he likes smell the drinks and taste it. [00:15:26] Speaker B: This is the. Denzel says, rubbing his hands as he does the bob and weave. That's. That's. Oh my God. I almost fell out of my chair when I heard it, which that was deliberate. That's clearly like somebody having a little bit of fun. Or better yet, what I want to believe is that he improv it. Yeah, that he improv it and he's kind of in on the joke, which might be possible too. [00:15:49] Speaker A: Did you think to yourself at times they're letting Denzel work. Although the garments that he's wearing are a bit. He's trying to handle them. There were a couple of shots where they. They. They just looked like he was messing with his garments quite a bit until he got comfortable. [00:16:14] Speaker B: I can answer this for you because he's doing the Denzel walk. You can see it. [00:16:18] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. [00:16:19] Speaker B: Yes, yes, yes. And you could see him doing the stride in the sandals and the toga, and it's hard. You could see him fighting it. It's really, really funny where it's like he's trying to do this long stride that he has. It's very authoritative, and it works great in mo. In pants. In short, doesn't work well in the robe. And it's funny to watch and send it flip. Like. I have to ask you a question that might be controversial because you kind of led with this look. The Oscar talk is ludicrous. Ludicrous. I think, is he good in this movie? I'm not saying he's not. I want to ask the question, is he actually good in this movie? [00:17:02] Speaker A: I think he's just Denzel, and that's good enough because he's a great performer. You know, he take. He'll take lines and just make it something so is not as memorable as other movies he's done, I would say. [00:17:17] Speaker B: So I'll give you. I don't think he's bad. [00:17:21] Speaker A: No. [00:17:22] Speaker B: But I think he's uneven, like the movie itself. Now, I read something from Ridley Scott, which I was trying to put in context for this movie, where he. It's a wild thing. He was asserting that. You guys can look up the quote. He says it about the emperors in particular, but he basically is like, there was so much lead poisoning in the water in Rome, it basically made a lot of these aristocrats crazy. And I kept watching. I had that quote in my head, and I'm watching Denzel, and I'm like, I think Denzel is trying to do this as like a half madman. Because there's definitely scenes where he acts and does things that are completely unhinged and different than what he's doing in the next scene. And I think it's an accident. I think he's trying to capture this. Like, this character is a little bit insane. But I have to be honest, I don't know that he would have been the best actor to do this. So I was like, okay, if I give you as an example, I think Sterling K. Brown could have done this part better than him. [00:18:28] Speaker A: Oh, yeah. [00:18:29] Speaker B: Am I wrong? To think that now he wouldn't have sold the movie as well, but the. [00:18:35] Speaker A: Performance perhaps would have been quite different. [00:18:37] Speaker B: Madness that I feel like Denzel is too cool to do. And it, it works somewhat. Like it's. It's riveting. Like, I'm watching it, but then I'm like, was that actually a good scene or not? Like, I'm not totally sure. [00:18:55] Speaker A: Yeah, he plays it too cool. Yeah, he tries to play it too cool. [00:19:00] Speaker B: And he's like laughing and smiling a lot. And it's like he's too handsome. So it's like the Denzel Hanks. I'm showing his pearly whites and I'm like, there's no way your teeth in ancient Rome will be that clean. Come on. Like, you know, And I'm like, I just feel like there's a. There's a. An actor that probably a tear down famous who might have been able to disappear into that role a little bit better than he was able to. [00:19:22] Speaker A: He didn't bring the intensity, I would say. And I think again, the writing does another disservice to Denzel as to. It really didn't. They didn't really do a good job of really making us care about his plan. [00:19:41] Speaker B: Well, I think this because I think the movie fell victim to the classic sequel trope of too complicated. If I think about what makes the original movie great, it's a fairly simplistic narrative. [00:19:55] Speaker A: Right. [00:19:57] Speaker B: Our hero is badass, we break him down and we build him back up with a revenge mission. Kind of that simple. [00:20:05] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:20:05] Speaker B: This movie has several interesting directions it could go in, and tries to go in all of them, and I don't know that it lands any one of them as a result. [00:20:16] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:20:17] Speaker B: So to your point, the mescal parallel revenge mission kind of gets pushed to the side because the guy that he's targeting, which I thought that's where we were going. And I was really interested because I was like, I had this feeling that Pedro Pascal was not totally a bad guy. I had this feeling, oh, he was not totally bad. And when it became clear that not only was he not totally a bad guy, but he was shacking up with Connie Nielsen, I was like, great. So this guy's going to be on a path of revenge and he's going to run smack into the legacy of his dad and his mom. That's cool. [00:20:52] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:20:52] Speaker B: And then that ended midway through the movie in a hail of arrows, which then led to the. Oh, right, I know. Denzel's shady and he's the ultimate villain of this movie, but that didn't feel as earned as Commodus villainy did in the first one. So that's two movies though, right? Like the movie to take revenge upon Denzel is a different movie than the movie to take revenge upon what you perceive to be the murderer of your wife. [00:21:18] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:21:18] Speaker B: And they have both of those movies in the same movie. [00:21:22] Speaker A: What did you think of the reveal? Although we already knew the connection between Paul Masco and Connie Nielsen. How did you feel about that connection? [00:21:37] Speaker B: Well, first off, Connie Nielsen, I mean, I know, right? [00:21:40] Speaker A: Still looks amazing. [00:21:41] Speaker B: I was looking. I was like, I was trying to put together the timeline of like, okay. Because they were describing her love life and I was like, in the movie. And I'm like, okay, so she had the original husband who couldn't get it done. She has the. The lovers, and then Maximus is the father, but that Maximus would have been 16 years ago. And now we have a sort of a 50 something looking Pedro Pascal who she's with. And she still looks younger than him. Yeah, I'm like, what is going on around here? Like, she's living like three lifetimes and that we're all living one. But anyway, so she was great. It was great to see her. You're right. Again, this goes to the point of like, the movie's trying to go in these different directions. And maybe in my mind, this goes to my point about the whole revenge mission. The movie I really want to see is the one that puts her center stage and Pascal center stage and puts Mescal on the collision course for that. That, to me, is the most emotionally moving. He's. He's having to re. Embrace his father's legacy. But now he's running into the guy who actually he views as killed his wife. And then it almost gets sidetracked by the Denzel thing. And then these two crazy emperors who are trying to be like commodities Commodus on steroids. Yeah, you're right. It kind of shortchanges you. Listen, now I will say this other thing I had in my head because really Scott's been talking about it. This movie is 145 minutes long. He's already said he has a 220 minute cut. And I'm like, this could be Kingdom of Heaven all over again. Because Kingdom of Heaven feels so heavily edited. And you're like, wait, what? What just happened? And then you watch the director's cut. You're like, oh, that's what you were trying to do. And the movie's great. I actually will watch the. I Actually am excited to see an extended cut of this because I do think, to your point, the Nielsen roll might be on the editing floor. [00:23:26] Speaker A: One thing about I was like, sort of like when I was watching it, I was smirking at it. Like, the shark thing, man, who is catching sharks? It's like, where were they stored? Yeah, but who is like, who has to clean this up after? I don't. I don't know. It's just crazy. It's just a little bit overboard for me. Yeah. [00:23:48] Speaker B: So it's interesting. So that. That is not totally inaccurate. So they did flood the Coliseum at points in history and they didn't introduce water predators. That. That was not like a completely made up thing that Ridley did that is actually based on. There's just evidence that that occurred. I don't know if they did this exact recreation. And I will say one of the strengths of this movie is that even at 86 years old, very few directors can do a battle scene like Ridley Scott can. Oh, yeah, that opening naval assault is awesome. [00:24:15] Speaker A: Oh, that was dope. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:24:16] Speaker B: Like, and some of the gladiator, like, some of the gladiator shots where you're like riding side saddle with the rhino Prime. Like, he still has that in his bag. And that's why I'm like, this movie is worth watching. Because there are those moments where you're like, he just can do things with a camera that other action directors can't. But to your point, it's uneven. And I will say, like, when they did, there's like one too many scenes in the Coliseum. I'm like, aren't we at the final fight yet? You know, and then the final fight doesn't even occur in the Coliseum. So you're kind of like, I feel like this movie was both too short and too long at the same time. [00:24:50] Speaker A: Yeah. You wanted more, Pedro Pascal. You wanted more. [00:24:52] Speaker B: Connie News 100. [00:24:55] Speaker A: They try to sell us a Denzel, you know, and, and, And I don't. [00:25:03] Speaker B: Like, the emperors are like, interesting characters, but they're ultimately kind of superfluous to the point of this. They just wanted to show that, like, Rome was falling apart. [00:25:11] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:25:12] Speaker B: But it's almost like, did we need these crazy, insane twins to really propel the key narrative forward? I don't know that we did. I don't know that we did right in the first one. Commodus becomes Emperor illegitimately. That is a huge. Yes, North Star. Wrong. Roper Crowe has to correct right in this one. These guys already have the throne. They're already crazy it's like their death only really serves to further Denzel a little bit. It's not really, like, necessary to the rest of the movie. [00:25:46] Speaker A: Yeah, I feel like they just threw Denzel there to be Denzel. His character really didn't mean much. Like, when he revealed his reasons for what he's doing, I didn't care, really. [00:25:58] Speaker B: Well, that's what I mean. Like, he's basically an evil Oliver Reed proxy. Yes. Proximo is a better character. Proxima is actually a better character for that movie than Denzel probably is for this movie, even though Denzel is a more celebrated actor. Like I said, he's not bad. And it's the same way I feel about. So this is the Sliding Doors moment. So, Fantastic Four fans, if you're paying attention, Joseph Quinn is g. The taller of the twin emperors. That's your Human Torch, A part that Joseph Quinn got because Paul Mescal passed on it to do this movie. [00:26:32] Speaker A: Paul Mescal passed on being Johnny Stone. [00:26:35] Speaker B: And now you have both the original Human Torch offer and the actual Human Torch in the same movie. Because they were going to conflict originally from the scheduling. Right. Everything's changed because of COVID and because of strikes. But Paul Mescal was offered the role and turned it down in part to do this movie. And there's Joseph Quinn, who will be Johnny Storm as Gata. [00:26:58] Speaker A: I think it was a good choice on his to do this role rather than do Johnny Storm. [00:27:04] Speaker B: I do, too. Although watching Joseph Quinn as Gata made me more interested to see him as Johnny Storm. Oh, he's like a good character as a crazy emperor. I thought he did a good job. [00:27:13] Speaker A: Oh, yeah. So, yeah, that dude is an actor. I think he's gonna bring it. Sadhana. [00:27:20] Speaker B: Now, I have one more Mescal question for you. I'm not the first person to say this, but I. I think I am getting on board the train. Paul Mescal as Wolverine. I think this movie made me believe he could do it. [00:27:35] Speaker A: Yes. Yes. I didn't even think about it, but now that you. He has. He has the attitude. And that's one thing that I've always thought of Wolverine should have. I was always a big Zach McGowan proponent. I was really pushing for that because I think he can bring that sort of Wolverine sort of attitude. And Paul Masco certainly can bring you all that. And how old is he? [00:28:11] Speaker B: 28, 29. [00:28:13] Speaker A: There you go. [00:28:14] Speaker B: That's why. [00:28:15] Speaker A: There you go. [00:28:16] Speaker B: And he knew you was not really lanky or tall the way Hugh Jackman Is he's stocky. He channels the rage really well. Like, he looks. [00:28:24] Speaker A: You can say he's 70 and. You can say he's 70. [00:28:26] Speaker B: Yeah. You do the make and I was looking exactly. I oper you could do the hair. I'm like, I. I could do it. I think he can do it. And he. The way that. Yeah. [00:28:35] Speaker A: Mind you. No, no, I don't think he can do it. He definitely can do it. [00:28:41] Speaker B: So that would lead to the. If this were to happen, which I think would be pretty awesome, he passes on Johnny Storm, he takes Gladiator 2 and then he winds up as Wolverine. I think we're definitely in a better place if that. If that's how this plays out. And I hope they. I hope they ask him, but I. [00:28:57] Speaker A: Think if you ask Kevin, right now he's all about Hugh Jackman and Dead and Ryan Reynolds. As long as he has some of the power now, he will never let that happen. Right. [00:29:06] Speaker B: That's because. That's because Kevin's in the. In the twilight of his Marvel days and he just wants to win the championship in this season. He doesn't care about 10 seasons from now. But we're trying to. [00:29:14] Speaker A: But, wow. [00:29:15] Speaker B: She ain't going 10 seasons. [00:29:16] Speaker A: Right. Forget it. I'm sorry. Zach McGowan. [00:29:22] Speaker B: Well, Zach, when you started talking about the Zach McGowan, I believe, was 34. And now he's like. Now he's. It's like 10 years later, literally. He's kind of. Yeah, it's. You know, it's like the Caval argument where it's like, that's great. But now Henry Cavill will be 41 next year. It's like, you know, we kind of miss that. [00:29:36] Speaker A: We'll talk about Cav later. [00:29:37] Speaker B: Yeah. In a whole other context. [00:29:40] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:29:40] Speaker B: Yeah. So I'm a believer. I'm like. I watched this movie and I'm like, my big Marvel takeaway is Joseph Quinn might be a good Johnny Storm and Paul Mescal, please take the call to do Loki. [00:29:51] Speaker A: Wow, man. Damn. That's. Yo, I'm telling you, I say I have retired the Zach McGowan, you know. Cheering now is Paul Mescal as Wolverine. That is number one top priority for me. [00:30:10] Speaker B: So this movie is doing pretty well. It's interesting. The worldwide audience in particular is all about this movie. So it did 55 million in the US that was slightly below projection. I think projection was 60. International audience, though. 165 at 3x on the international. People are fired up for this movie overseas. He's going to do some bank. It's probably only. It's not going to get to the heights of the original in the US But I think the global is going to go past. [00:30:35] Speaker A: What was the original heights in the. [00:30:36] Speaker B: US I think the U. Original US one, I think was around 200, I want to say. And then, you know, like, global, like, was probably a little less than that. So it's like. Like a little under 400. This is going to do like 500, 600. Like, they're going to very much justify. Now, will they make money? Will depend on how much that rumored huge budget is true. Right. Which is close to big. 350, 400 million. But this is going to make more money than the original, which is sort of saying something, considering how popular the original is. But. And really, Scott's already talking Gladiator 3, which I did not. I did not need that. I did not need that, man. I don't think it's good enough to warrant that. [00:31:11] Speaker A: I would say, yeah, the MVP would be Paul Mescal, obviously. Right? Yeah. [00:31:15] Speaker B: Mescal wins the movie, which I think is considering he's opposite Denzel in a lot of scenes. Like, you gotta put a nice little underscore on that. Like, you stood. He stood toe to toe with one of the greatest actors of our lifetime, and he won the movie. Like, that's something. That's something you put on the resume. [00:31:32] Speaker A: That's one thing Denzel was right about. He definitely delivered because he'd been on store with him and saying that he's. He definitely delivers in this movie. [00:31:40] Speaker B: Well, that's right. I'll always say that Ethan Hawke got robbed of the supporting actor for Training Day because of the same reason. Like, he stood toe to toe with Denzel in his prime. And he's every bit as good as Denzel in that movie. And they passed him over, which I think is unconscionable. I don't even remember who won that year. And I don't care. Like, he should have won. So, like, in this movie, like, if you're like, hey, I can only give one Academy Award to this movie, and I don't think this movie will win Academy Awards, but I give it to Mescal. Like, he. He's the best character and best performance in this film. [00:32:10] Speaker A: I was watching this movie waiting for certain beats to happen, and they happened. I was waiting for the reaction similar to Maximus when he says to Kanye Nissan's character, then have him kill comedies. Right? Instead. Instead we got get out. But am I happy it exists? Yes. Am I glad I saw it. Yes. Because I got to see someone new, someone on the rise. Someone you're looking forward to seeing in other projects. Someone you looking forward to seeing now as Wolverine. It will be criminal not to offer this dude the next. I'm. I'm sorry, Hugh. Well, you gotta pass the torch, man. [00:33:01] Speaker B: Yeah. No, Hugh, there's no apologies. Your jersey is going to the rafters. Don't worry. Not. We're not. We're not doing any shame on. Or putting any shade on your legacy. [00:33:10] Speaker A: We just. I just, you know. [00:33:12] Speaker B: Yeah, but you had your send off in Logan and you got your encore and Deadpool Wolverine, and it sounds like you might probably even get one more encore in Secret Wars. All good, man. You get. You got to take your curtain calls like you're. You're a legend. Nobody's. Nobody's coming. Coming for that. But I like that this guy because of the crow thing. What makes me confident is that he could etch a different Wolverine that people gravitate toward. And that's critical. It is critical. Huge. Huge shadow is the same size as Downey shadow as Iron Man. It's a. It's a huge shadow for whoever takes over that part. And you have that. [00:33:46] Speaker A: That's what it's all about. [00:33:47] Speaker B: Yeah. And this guy can do it. [00:33:49] Speaker A: If you find that successor, go for it. [00:33:52] Speaker B: But now, hey, look, the last time. Last time we said this, we spoke it into existence. Aaron Pierre is Jon Stewart. [00:33:59] Speaker A: So hopefully people get on board with that because there's. There's no denying it right there. There's no denying it. [00:34:08] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:34:09] Speaker A: You give this guy the schedule, whatever it is you need to get into in order for him to do other things, because we just don't want to see him and just Wolverine want to see him. What kind of range this dude got, right? We saw plenty loser here, Luther. [00:34:24] Speaker B: Biggest loser of the movie to me, other than your diamond, Hansu, which I think is a very good point, is Spencer Treat Clark, who played Lucius in the original movie. They had to wipe him out of the flashbacks and put another kid, age appropriate, in the hood seat. I'm like, that's a tough L, man. Not only did you not get to play the grown up character, they erased you from your own part from the original. That's a. [00:34:48] Speaker A: Just waiting for the cut. Okay. They finally. From the pattern. Oh, there it is. There's a. There's the re. Shoot. Oh, man. [00:35:01] Speaker B: What did you think of Pascal in this movie? You know, we. We kind of glossed over wanting more. But like, what did you think of his. The part that he did have, like, what did it mean? Did you want more of that? [00:35:10] Speaker A: Oh, yeah, I wanted more paler, Pascal, because you saw his reluctance, his seemingly sort of same relationship as. As Maximus had with the senators back then. In terms of that comment, whatever conversation that had, he was always uncomfortable and always answered what he needed to answer, and that was it. So he had that sort of same similar relationship. And yeah, he. Listen, I like Pedro Pascal. I just don't want him to be in every damn thing and you don't care about it, you know what I'm saying? And us wanting more because we know what he can give. I mean, Fantastic Four will be his shot. [00:35:51] Speaker B: This felt like I said, I did think they hit on this interesting middle ground of like, he was part Maximus, part villain. And then he had his own moral conflict. And I was like, man, why did we cut that off? And like, it was just getting good. Like, they were confronted in the arena and like, it was starting to discover some other motives and then got cut off. And it's like, it's the biggest what if for this movie, to me, is if they've rewritten that to really make. [00:36:18] Speaker A: That would have been the focal point. This movie would have been on par. Perhaps it's still even below Bush, on par with that first one. [00:36:27] Speaker B: I think it's worth another star. And I think it simplifies the back. I think it simplifies the third act, if that's what we're aiming for. Rather than this sort of like twist upon. Twist upon political twist that was going on with Denzel and the emperors and the Senate. By the way, that dude who played Gracchus and was I Claudius, Derek Jacob, how is he alive? Like, that dude was like 85 when you did iCloud. And that's like 1982. Like, I don't understand. He looked the same. [00:36:57] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah. But you could definitely. I could hear it in his. Because that's what a lot of people saying. He still looks exactly the same as he did before. He certainly sounded his ace. [00:37:07] Speaker B: Yes. [00:37:08] Speaker A: But I was. I was like, man, they got rid of him. Like, really, like, ferociously. [00:37:13] Speaker B: See that? That felt like. That felt like. That felt like the Michael Douglas Hank Pim. He's like. He's like, I ain't do another one of these. [00:37:20] Speaker A: Please. [00:37:21] Speaker B: Please take. [00:37:22] Speaker A: Kill me. Please. Oh, my God. Oh, man. So you want to give a star rating or do you have anything else you want to. [00:37:38] Speaker B: No, I think that's. I think that's a good discussion. So I would go three. To me, it's like it justifies its existence. I think you have a good time if you go see it. You certainly enjoy it if you pull it up on rental. But it is flawed. It is uneven. But I think with Mescal being as good as he is, I can't go down to like one and a half or two given some of the other movies that are. Given that Star Trek. So to me, it's a three, and the original is probably a four and a half or a five. [00:38:03] Speaker A: Paul Mescal's performance in this warrants it being a three and a half. Because when you. Even though it's not that it's not the first one. Certainly not. But it definitely does echo the first one. When I see it on tv, I'm watching. Performance is one of those rewatchable type of movies where, okay, I'm out now. Okay, I'm done. There's a lot of movies like that where. Like Police Academy, the first one, after the. After. After the fight start, that's when you're like, I'm out. So this. This movie has some of those moments where, like, okay, I don't want to see this anymore. But his performance is one of those captivating ones that I think you would stick around to watch for a few moments. [00:38:44] Speaker B: I agree. [00:38:45] Speaker A: So let us know in the comment section below what you guys think of this. A sequel to a classic movie that when it was first rumored, we scoffed at the notion of a possible Gladiator 2. Again, go on the Internet and see what they tried to do to. Russell Crowe. Wanted to come back, but if they would have gone those routes. If. Forget about. Forget about it. But, yeah, listen, well, hang on, Russell. [00:39:21] Speaker B: You'Re a Russell Crowe fan. You get to see him as Craven, the hunter's father in a couple weeks. Doing a Russian accent. So you get that. The other thing I gotta say as we're going out is Ridley Scott, who I love, has definitely earned a place in the David Zaslav hall of Fame as a hype man. Because if you remember, he called, I. [00:39:44] Speaker A: Was thinking about Desert Eli Ill, his best film. [00:39:49] Speaker B: And I'm like. I'm like, dude, I said, you still are throwing a fastball when it comes to some action scenes and some battle sequences. [00:39:57] Speaker A: Still Nolan Ryan. [00:39:58] Speaker B: Yes, but no, man, not with what else you have in the catalog. You can't. You can't. And you can't say that. You can't believe that. You can't believe that. [00:40:11] Speaker A: Oh, man, I'm gonna try. I'm gonna try to go back to that. To that. That would be a good start off the show with that. Now you'll see if he's lying on. Oh, man. So, yeah, let us know in the comment section below what you guys thought of Gladiator 2 and we'll see you next time on the Nerd J Report.